In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 4NL to 20NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 20NL within 12 months : Yeah sounds good mate. There's the potential I will be at 8NL by then but I dunno, I'm at £165 now and will be moving up when I have 50 BIs so (£400), so maybe, maybe not, I'll keep ya posted anyway. Posted by Lambert180
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 4NL to 20NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 20NL within 12 months : Yeah sounds good mate. There's the potential I will be at 8NL by then but I dunno, I'm at £165 now and will be moving up when I have 50 BIs so (£400), so maybe, maybe not, I'll keep ya posted anyway. Posted by Lambert180
Ok well il be moving up too. Not sure how much I'm going to deposit yet but it will be quite small and il prob move up to nl8 when i reach £200. Will probably only deposit £50 tbh. Have a think and let me know if you want to add a prize etc. Will be starting my quest next week.
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 4NL to 20NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 20NL within 12 months : why so many? Posted by DOHHHHHHH
Well I think you need more BIs in your roll, the more tables you play for a start. When I step up to 10NL, I'll probably start with 2-3 and move to 4-6 when I get happy with things and have notes on some players. But when I move to 20NL+ a level I've NEVER played a single hand of, I'll be playing 1-2 tables max for a while just til I get into it.
I want to get in the habit of good BRM now so it's just automatic when I move to higher levels where it'll be much more important. I also want the comfort of a larger BR when I move to levels which I have not played before as it will be a learning process as I go, and I want a big enough BR to be able to learn without stressing out that I lost 20% of my BR in one bad session.
So I'll playing a 50 BI strategy for each level, and stepping back down when/if I drop to 40BIs for that level.
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 4NL to 20NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 20NL within 12 months : Apologies if I have not replied to you in the past Devon, I do generally try to reply to everyone who posts on here. Yeah I started with the whole BIs thing, but it was just stupid and didn't really work, as most times the ups and downs are never gonna be easy multiples of a BI or even 1/2 a BI, so I'm just sticking to straight forward profit/loss now, including the number of hands so you have an idea of volumes. Yeah no hard feelings at all Dev. When I post hands, it's generally one of two things... if I post a proper HH like the AJ hand above, then it's to get feedback on how I played it etc like the clinic. If I am just posting a brief description of what happened, it's generally me just venting about coolers lol, although granted that's hardly great reading for most. Posted by Lambert180
hi Paul, glad you've taken my post in good spirit m8. i really do wish you all the best & gl with hitting your targets. dev
I think that's wayyyyy too nitty, especially for the first jump from nl4 to nl8. and then to nl10. You might have a point nl10 to 20, but still abit much imo. You don't have to make a big deal of moving up, you can play nl10 and nl4 together. Having £350 (built up from £100 or whatever) and still grinding nl4 is just mental imo. 25xbuy ins to 'shoot' at the level above is fine. edit* Yes I've been stuck at the same level for literally years now etc etc, different @ micro micros tho :P Posted by DOHHHHHHH
It could be slightly on the nitty side for 4NL and 8NL but it never hurts to have too big a BR and I think it's perfectly fine for 10NL+ and it certainly won't hurt to get into good habits.
To be honest, I'm only £235 away from moving up, which is 58.75 BIs. If you reckon on me getting about £20 C4P over a 4 month period then that means it's £215 I need to make which is 53.75 BIs which over 4 months is only 13.5 BIs per month which is not an enormous amount, so even though I've set the bar high, I don't think I'll be at 4NL for that long. I'd rather do it right than do it quickly.
Leading on from your last comment, have you ever tried playing above 50NL+ ? Is it the monetary amount on the table that would put you off or do you not think you're good enough?
BOOM! Another great session tonight, even despite a JJ v AA incident pre where I think could have folded but I was swayed by him only having £3. Managed to finish £15.05 in profit for the night so I'm finally back in the black
i rarely comment on diary threads but having read a bit of yours in the last few days i'm compelled to ask...
doesn't a diary thread take some of the fun out of poker?
the reason i ask is because all of the diary threads seem to talk about poker in terms of a 'challenge' or a 'grind'. also, i noticed in the last few posts you have made it doesn't seem like you are getting any pleasure out of playing the game (at least not currently) and i think this is quite common among the diary threads i have seen.
the best comparison i can try and make is that if i were to go and play football with my mates on the park i would hate to be constantly looking at ways to improve my passing or shooting (although arguably i should) etc and then come home and think through the game and try and spot ways i could have done better. that would take some of the fun out of the game for me and probably make me less excited about the next kickaround on the park because i would feel under pressure all the time.
i genuinely enjoy reading your diary and will keep following it as it is certainly one of the best i have read.
good luck
p.s if i had your bankroll i would go for 3 tables of 20nl and move down to 10nl if i got down to 100
edit: standard timing....my post goes in straight after a big winning sessions lol....nice work though
hi i rarely comment on diary threads but having read a bit of yours in the last few days i'm compelled to ask... doesn't a diary thread take some of the fun out of poker? the reason i ask is because all of the diary threads seem to talk about poker in terms of a 'challenge' or a 'grind'. also, i noticed in the last few posts you have made it doesn't seem like you are getting any pleasure out of playing the game (at least not currently) and i think this is quite common among the diary threads i have seen. the best comparison i can try and make is that if i were to go and play football with my mates on the park i would hate to be constantly looking at ways to improve my passing or shooting (although arguably i should) etc and then come home and think through the game and try and spot ways i could have done better. that would take some of the fun out of the game for me and probably make me less excited about the next kickaround on the park because i would feel under pressure all the time. i genuinely enjoy reading your diary and will keep following it as it is certainly one of the best i have read. good luck p.s if i had your bankroll i would go for 3 tables of 20nl and move down to 10nl if i got down to 100 edit: standard timing....my post goes in straight after a big winning sessions lol....nice work though Posted by huuuuume
This. Everyone seems to go way OTT with the bankroll management !
hi i rarely comment on diary threads but having read a bit of yours in the last few days i'm compelled to ask... doesn't a diary thread take some of the fun out of poker? the reason i ask is because all of the diary threads seem to talk about poker in terms of a 'challenge' or a 'grind'. also, i noticed in the last few posts you have made it doesn't seem like you are getting any pleasure out of playing the game (at least not currently) and i think this is quite common among the diary threads i have seen. the best comparison i can try and make is that if i were to go and play football with my mates on the park i would hate to be constantly looking at ways to improve my passing or shooting (although arguably i should) etc and then come home and think through the game and try and spot ways i could have done better. that would take some of the fun out of the game for me and probably make me less excited about the next kickaround on the park because i would feel under pressure all the time. i genuinely enjoy reading your diary and will keep following it as it is certainly one of the best i have read. good luck p.s if i had your bankroll i would go for 3 tables of 20nl and move down to 10nl if i got down to 100 Posted by huuuuume
Hi huuuuume,
I definitely see what you're saying, and it can be trying sometimes but at the base of it all I do love the game. Obviously it's hard to enjoy the patches where you're getting constantly coolered but as I say I do love the game, and it's all the more love-able when you make money from it, and generally the only way to do this is to assess your play and try to improve it.
I know all players at any level need to look to improve their game but the need to improve is probably more important with me because my game is SO in need of improvement.
In answer to your last comment about if you had a bankroll... I've never played a single hand of 20NL and to be honest, judging by your posts on the clinic etc you are a far better player than me, so I just wouldn't feel comfortable at 20NL with the size of my roll. I'm still making the occasional really clumsy mistakes at 4NL and I'd probably just be punished for this more at 20NL.
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 4NL to 20NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 20NL within 12 months : This. Everyone seems to go way OTT with the bankroll management ! Posted by 1267
The thing is though, I'm just simply not that good lol, and I've went about 2-3 years now without going bust once through beating low levels and keeping myself in check with regards to BRM.
I'm sure you and Huuume are capable of playing 20NL with £180, but at this stage, I just don't have the confidence in my game to do it.
I think you wrote into the show about BRM and I think I gave the advice to errr on the side of caution. For 4nl and for only 4 tables then 30/40 is fine. IMO I'd be more than happy to mix in a couple of 8nl tables while also playing 4nl. Posted by scotty77
Yeah I did write into the show about BRM, mostly because (as I said in my post to the show), the general consensus seems to be 20BIs is fine at micro stakes, but I just wasn't happy with it when playing between 4 and 6 tables. But yeah I agree 30/40 BIs is probably fine, although I certainly want 50BIs for 10NL+
I think your far to worried about losing a few buy-ins and having to move down a level.
You could easily be playing nl20 right now, with a 180 quid. Lets be honest it would take a pretty tragic session to lose 80 quid, and even then you would have a solid 10 buy ins at nl10 . Which is more than enough. No shame in moving down. Obv with like 70+ buy ins, theres never going to really be a need to move down in levels, unless you have the worst variance EVER or are actually a bad player. Been a bankroll nit is fine and all. But i think you would enjoy it so so so much more if you gambled a tad at nl20 and spun 180 up to 500 in a week or so. Then the possibilities are endless. Stop worrying. If you have an absolute mare and have to move down, no biggy !
hi Paul, as you are all talking brm i'll throw in my 10c worth.
brm is most definately a 'personal thing' some players are happy playing a level with 10-20 buy-ins others 30-40. i personally feel pretty comfortable with 100 but ideally for moving up levels i would like 200. how do you feel when losing 10 buy-ins when you have only got 100 lor worse still 50?
I think your far to worried about losing a few buy-ins and having to move down a level. You could easily be playing nl20 right now, with a 180 quid. Lets be honest it would take a pretty tragic session to lose 80 quid, and even then you would have a solid 10 buy ins at nl10 . Which is more than enough. No shame in moving down. Obv with like 70+ buy ins, theres never going to really be a need to move down in levels, unless you have the worst variance EVER or are actually a bad player. Been a bankroll nit is fine and all. But i think you would enjoy it so so so much more if you gambled a tad at nl20 and spun 180 up to 500 in a week or so. Then the possibilities are endless. Stop worrying. If you have an absolute mare and have to move down, no biggy ! Posted by 1267
Yeah I definitely see where you're coming from, but I'm more concerned about the fact I'm really not that great a player. I have massive leaks in my game, and so I'm trying to improve my game at the lower levels where the risk is smaller.
hi Paul, as you are all talking brm i'll throw in my 10c worth. brm is most definately a 'personal thing' some players are happy playing a level with 10-20 buy-ins others 30-40. i personally feel pretty comfortable with 100 but ideally for moving up levels i would like 200. how do you feel when losing 10 buy-ins when you have only got 100 lor worse still 50? anyway ,i've had my say. best wishes dev Posted by devonfish5
Yeah I most definitely agree, I think there's a required minimum to be able to withstand the variance involved in any form of poker, but past that it comes down to how happy you are about actually taking the beats.
Personally, when I was playing cash with 20BIs, I felt pretty rubbish about it if I lost 3-4 BIs because it's still a pretty big chunk of my roll. One thing I read in a book recently about the poker mindset was about BRM/dealing with variance and it said that there are 2 beasts to tackle.... it's not just about avoiding going bust through poor BRM, it's also about avoiding the fear of going bust.
I know how my brain works and I know I would be reluctant to take some lines like maybe 3bet jamming a flop with 2 overs + FD if my BR was really small because I know the losses would hurt so I would attempt to play a lower variance form which would invariably be much less profitable.
i chop and change from 30 to 50 BI depending how well im running nothing wrong in upping it a bit from time to time and if it dosnt go your way drop back down again. If theres a torny that tickles my fancy and has a decent prize pool for the amount i might have a go at it and dont get too caught up in the BI philosopy maybe i should maybe i shouldnt each to there own imo. As long as you dont gamble your br with 4BI or less which ive also done in the past lol. Only you know lambert what your comfortable with and how much it will let you just enjoy the game The trick is ask yourself if you lose does it hurt if the answer is yes then you playing to high stakes for your br.
Was a bit of an annoying session tonight, made a few really stupid calls that turned what would have been a small profit into a slight loss. Definitely wasn't my A game tonight, mainly just down to playing a bit too loose pre.
Comments
I want to get in the habit of good BRM now so it's just automatic when I move to higher levels where it'll be much more important. I also want the comfort of a larger BR when I move to levels which I have not played before as it will be a learning process as I go, and I want a big enough BR to be able to learn without stressing out that I lost 20% of my BR in one bad session.
So I'll playing a 50 BI strategy for each level, and stepping back down when/if I drop to 40BIs for that level.
glad you've taken my post in good spirit m8.
i really do wish you all the best & gl with hitting your targets.
dev
To be honest, I'm only £235 away from moving up, which is 58.75 BIs. If you reckon on me getting about £20 C4P over a 4 month period then that means it's £215 I need to make which is 53.75 BIs which over 4 months is only 13.5 BIs per month which is not an enormous amount, so even though I've set the bar high, I don't think I'll be at 4NL for that long. I'd rather do it right than do it quickly.
Leading on from your last comment, have you ever tried playing above 50NL+ ? Is it the monetary amount on the table that would put you off or do you not think you're good enough?
Hands Played: 7080
Bankroll: £180.07
Profit/Loss: +£5.03
Poker Points: 576 (£5.76)
i rarely comment on diary threads but having read a bit of yours in the last few days i'm compelled to ask...
doesn't a diary thread take some of the fun out of poker?
the reason i ask is because all of the diary threads seem to talk about poker in terms of a 'challenge' or a 'grind'. also, i noticed in the last few posts you have made it doesn't seem like you are getting any pleasure out of playing the game (at least not currently) and i think this is quite common among the diary threads i have seen.
the best comparison i can try and make is that if i were to go and play football with my mates on the park i would hate to be constantly looking at ways to improve my passing or shooting (although arguably i should) etc and then come home and think through the game and try and spot ways i could have done better. that would take some of the fun out of the game for me and probably make me less excited about the next kickaround on the park because i would feel under pressure all the time.
i genuinely enjoy reading your diary and will keep following it as it is certainly one of the best i have read.
good luck
p.s if i had your bankroll i would go for 3 tables of 20nl and move down to 10nl if i got down to 100
edit: standard timing....my post goes in straight after a big winning sessions lol....nice work though
Everyone seems to go way OTT with the bankroll management !
I definitely see what you're saying, and it can be trying sometimes but at the base of it all I do love the game. Obviously it's hard to enjoy the patches where you're getting constantly coolered but as I say I do love the game, and it's all the more love-able when you make money from it, and generally the only way to do this is to assess your play and try to improve it.
I know all players at any level need to look to improve their game but the need to improve is probably more important with me because my game is SO in need of improvement.
In answer to your last comment about if you had a bankroll... I've never played a single hand of 20NL and to be honest, judging by your posts on the clinic etc you are a far better player than me, so I just wouldn't feel comfortable at 20NL with the size of my roll. I'm still making the occasional really clumsy mistakes at 4NL and I'd probably just be punished for this more at 20NL.
P.S. Thanks for saying my diary is one the best
I'm sure you and Huuume are capable of playing 20NL with £180, but at this stage, I just don't have the confidence in my game to do it.
i understand the brm thing and am a control bankroll nit myself but...
positive thinking.......just imagine how good a winning session at nl20 would feel
You could easily be playing nl20 right now, with a 180 quid. Lets be honest it would take a pretty tragic session to lose 80 quid, and even then you would have a solid 10 buy ins at nl10 . Which is more than enough. No shame in moving down. Obv with like 70+ buy ins, theres never going to really be a need to move down in levels, unless you have the worst variance EVER or are actually a bad player. Been a bankroll nit is fine and all. But i think you would enjoy it so so so much more if you gambled a tad at nl20 and spun 180 up to 500 in a week or so.
Then the possibilities are endless. Stop worrying. If you have an absolute mare and have to move down, no biggy !
as you are all talking brm i'll throw in my 10c worth.
brm is most definately a 'personal thing'
some players are happy playing a level with 10-20 buy-ins
others 30-40.
i personally feel pretty comfortable with 100 but ideally for moving up levels i would like 200.
how do you feel when losing 10 buy-ins when you have only got 100 lor worse still 50?
anyway ,i've had my say.
best wishes
dev
Personally, when I was playing cash with 20BIs, I felt pretty rubbish about it if I lost 3-4 BIs because it's still a pretty big chunk of my roll. One thing I read in a book recently about the poker mindset was about BRM/dealing with variance and it said that there are 2 beasts to tackle.... it's not just about avoiding going bust through poor BRM, it's also about avoiding the fear of going bust.
I know how my brain works and I know I would be reluctant to take some lines like maybe 3bet jamming a flop with 2 overs + FD if my BR was really small because I know the losses would hurt so I would attempt to play a lower variance form which would invariably be much less profitable.
Hands Played: 7920
Bankroll: £173.39
Profit/Loss: -£1.65
Poker Points: 601 (£6.01)
At least I've made 1.5 BIs through C4P this month