I don't have any access to the numbers, so I have exactly the same info as you. I would be pretty sure that it IS possible to make money at them, that some folks do make money at them, & that some players really enjoy them.
Let's move away from Spin Ups, & look at "regular" poker. Does everyone make money at that? Of course they don't, & you all know that. Most of us are net depositors, but we either kid ourselves, or just enjoy trying to make a few bob, &, most of all, enjoy ourselves.
Why is losing money at Spin Ups different to losing money at regular cash games, MTT's or SNG's? If all those who lost money stopped playing, poker would shut down within a few days....
Sorry, but poker players happily "scope" & bumhunt losing players, & eagerly sit at a table with a so-called "fish", look for "weak" tables & players. Is that immoral?
You never seen a high stakes cash game on this site with one "fish" & all the pros queuing up to take his money, then snap quitting when the mark leaves? Some players on this thread have done exactly that.
What about a Heads Up game & one player disco's? Do we all sit there & wait, or send the guy his money back?
It's poker, a gambling game, a game played for money. It's a bit rich to accuse Sky Poker of being ""immoral" for offering a game, when we as poker players exploit every single edge we can.
One person says Spin Ups are "immoral", & soon everyone is repeating it, & stating it as a fact.
There's nothing immoral or misleading about it.
I'm sorry that we don't see eye to eye on so many of the points made, but I can only speak as I find, & think. I don't really want to have a ruck, or fall out with you all, but I can't allow all these comments to go unanswered. Players are making stuff up, so I think I have the same right as you do to state my views.
I have no problem with these tables existing, In fact i have played on them quite a lot when there has been some sort of rake/points promotion but i do feel punters should not be directed towards them the way they currently are, I think its fair to say that its the least skillful form of poker on Sky, and i would imagine the most addictive. Playing regular cash/Mtts or sng's dont offer that quick thrill that you can get from spin ups where you are going all in so often. you can see how people can get addicted to them.
Someone who was on my table during the £11 rebuy yesterday said he had built his bankroll up to £250 that month playing sngs and then blown it all on the spin ups in 30mins, You have to wonder how many other people that has happened to.
The players who have good common sense, an understanding of poker and self control will probably never have any issue with the spin-ups but its the people who lack any of those 3 traits that could blow a load of money without ever really having time to think about what they are doing.
Everyone knows Cigarettes harm you yet you still get the warnings on the packet , so it would be good to see something similar implimented on the spin up tables.. maybe a warning after losing x amount of buy ins/deposits or some sort of information outlet explaining that the spin-up tables are the most volatile form of poker etc
I dont expect Sky to make any changes at all because at the end of the day they work. But I do feel its our duty to push for a change none the less.
I have no problem with these tables existing, In fact i have played on them quite a lot when there has been some sort of rake/points promotion but i do feel punters should not be directed towards them the way they currently are, I think its fair to say that its the least skillful form of poker on Sky, and i would imagine the most addictive. Playing regular cash/Mtts or sng's dont offer that quick thrill that you can get from spin ups where you are going all in so often. you can see how people can get addicted to them. Someone who was on my table during the £11 rebuy yesterday said he had built his bankroll up to £250 that month playing sngs and then blown it all on the spin ups in 30mins, You have to wonder how many other people that has happened to. The players who have good common sense, an understanding of poker and self control will probably never have any issue with the spin-ups but its the people who lack any of those 3 traits that could blow a load of money without ever really having time to think about what they are doing. Everyone knows Cigarettes harm you yet you still get the warnings on the packet , so it would be good to see something similar implimented on the spin up tables.. maybe a warning after losing x amount of buy ins/deposits or some sort of information outlet explaining that the spin-up tables are the most volatile form of poker etc I dont expect Sky to make any changes at all because at the end of the day they work. But I do feel its our duty to push for a change none the less. Posted by jordz16
I don't have ANY problem at all with that sort of thing, Jordz.
It's when people make stuff up, & then others, sheep like, lazily copy those untruths, that I feel the need to bring some balance (and FACTS) to the thread.
"It's immoral", "it's like FOBT's". Sorry, but poker players happily "scope" & bumhunt losing players, & eagerly sit at a table with a so-called "fish", look for "weak" tables & players. Is that immoral? You never seen a high stakes cash game on this site with one "fish" & all the pros queuing up to take his money, then snap quitting when the mark leaves? Some players on this thread have done exactly that. What about a Heads Up game & one player disco's? Do we all sit there & wait, or send the guy his money back? It's poker, a gambling game, a game played for money. It's a bit rich to accuse Sky Poker of being ""immoral" for offering a game, when we as poker players exploit every single edge we can. One person says Spin Ups are "immoral", & soon everyone is repeating it, & stating it as a fact. There's nothing immoral or misleading about it. I'm sorry that we don't see eye to eye on so many of the points made, but I can only speak as I find, & think. I don't really want to have a ruck, or fall out with you all, but I can't allow all these comments to go unanswered. Players are making stuff up, so I think I have the same right as you do to state my views. Posted by Tikay10
I hardly ever play cash so cant comment on that part, but i believe they do have big similarities to "FOBT's because they allow players to lose a lot of money very quickly without allowing time for thought, My GF left her job at a bookies because they were constantly forcing staff to push the FOBT's and advertise in the best light they can. I believe it bares comparison to advertising Spin-ups above any other cash game, as if thats the best game that everyone should be playing when most players who pick those games are in fact far worse off for doing so..
"It's immoral", "it's like FOBT's". Sorry, but poker players happily "scope" & bumhunt losing players, & eagerly sit at a table with a so-called "fish", look for "weak" tables & players. Is that immoral? You never seen a high stakes cash game on this site with one "fish" & all the pros queuing up to take his money, then snap quitting when the mark leaves? Some players on this thread have done exactly that. What about a Heads Up game & one player disco's? Do we all sit there & wait, or send the guy his money back? It's poker, a gambling game, a game played for money. It's a bit rich to accuse Sky Poker of being ""immoral" for offering a game, when we as poker players exploit every single edge we can. One person says Spin Ups are "immoral", & soon everyone is repeating it, & stating it as a fact. There's nothing immoral or misleading about it. I'm sorry that we don't see eye to eye on so many of the points made, but I can only speak as I find, & think. I don't really want to have a ruck, or fall out with you all, but I can't allow all these comments to go unanswered. Players are making stuff up, so I think I have the same right as you do to state my views. Posted by Tikay10
Well said. The only reason these guys want spin ups removed (or, at the very least, advertised less) is because they want to take a greater percentage of these recreational players money, which they are able to do at the 100bb or master cash tables.
At the end of the day, if you don't like spin ups, just don't play them. Complaining to get them removed won't achieve anything.
I have no problem with these tables existing, In fact i have played on them quite a lot when there has been some sort of rake/points promotion but i do feel punters should not be directed towards them the way they currently are, I think its fair to say that its the least skillful form of poker on Sky, and i would imagine the most addictive. Playing regular cash/Mtts or sng's dont offer that quick thrill that you can get from spin ups where you are going all in so often. you can see how people can get addicted to them. Someone who was on my table during the £11 rebuy yesterday said he had built his bankroll up to £250 that month playing sngs and then blown it all on the spin ups in 30mins, You have to wonder how many other people that has happened to. The players who have good common sense, an understanding of poker and self control will probably never have any issue with the spin-ups but its the people who lack any of those 3 traits that could blow a load of money without ever really having time to think about what they are doing. Everyone knows Cigarettes harm you yet you still get the warnings on the packet , so it would be good to see something similar implimented on the spin up tables.. maybe a warning after losing x amount of buy ins/deposits or some sort of information outlet explaining that the spin-up tables are the most volatile form of poker etc I dont expect Sky to make any changes at all because at the end of the day they work. But I do feel its our duty to push for a change none the less. Posted by jordz16
There are plenty of warnings about responsible gaming at the bottom of every single page. I don't see any reason for Sky to implement a warning especially for spin ups. The risks of spin ups are no different to many other games.
In Response to Re: Spin Ups killing SKY Poker : There are plenty of warnings about responsible gaming at the bottom of every single page. I don't see any reason for Sky to implement a warning especially for spin ups. The risks of spin ups are no different to many other games. Posted by Aerionz
I have no problem with these tables existing, In fact i have played on them quite a lot when there has been some sort of rake/points promotion but i do feel punters should not be directed towards them the way they currently are, I think its fair to say that its the least skillful form of poker on Sky, and i would imagine the most addictive. Playing regular cash/Mtts or sng's dont offer that quick thrill that you can get from spin ups where you are going all in so often. you can see how people can get addicted to them. Someone who was on my table during the £11 rebuy yesterday said he had built his bankroll up to £250 that month playing sngs and then blown it all on the spin ups in 30mins, You have to wonder how many other people that has happened to. The players who have good common sense, an understanding of poker and self control will probably never have any issue with the spin-ups but its the people who lack any of those 3 traits that could blow a load of money without ever really having time to think about what they are doing. Everyone knows Cigarettes harm you yet you still get the warnings on the packet , so it would be good to see something similar implimented on the spin up tables.. maybe a warning after losing x amount of buy ins/deposits or some sort of information outlet explaining that the spin-up tables are the most volatile form of poker etc I dont expect Sky to make any changes at all because at the end of the day they work. But I do feel its our duty to push for a change none the less. Posted by jordz16
The cigarettes might be getting all these warnings and hidden away but the same can't be said about alcohol. All the damage which can be done by alcohol doesn't stop it from being advertised on TV, a sponser in sport or become hidden away, you can still recieve free samples in super markets, I myself had a free sample of peach flavoured WKD the other week and have started to have the odd full bottle of that during a football match rather than a small bottle of general beer or can of lager.
If gamblig becomes a serious problem people can speak to gamble aware otherwise or learn to cut down on it themselves, no different to alcoholics really.
In Response to Re: Spin Ups killing SKY Poker : The cigarettes might be getting all these warnings and hidden away but the same can't be said about alcohol. All the damage which can be done by alcohol doesn't stop it from being advertised on TV, a sponser in sport or become hidden away, you can still recieve free samples in super markets, I myself had a free sample of peach flavoured WKD the other week and have started to have the odd full bottle of that during a football match rather than a small bottle of general beer or can of lager. If gamblig becomes a serious problem people can speak to gamble aware otherwise or learn to cut down on it themselves, no different to alcoholics really. Posted by craigcu12
In Response to Re: Spin Ups killing SKY Poker : The cigarettes might be getting all these warnings and hidden away but the same can't be said about alcohol. All the damage which can be done by alcohol doesn't stop it from being advertised on TV, a sponser in sport or become hidden away, you can still recieve free samples in super markets, I myself had a free sample of peach flavoured WKD the other week and have started to have the odd full bottle of that during a football match rather than a small bottle of general beer or can of lager. If gamblig becomes a serious problem people can speak to gamble aware otherwise or learn to cut down on it themselves, no different to alcoholics really. Posted by craigcu12
thats all valid, my main issue is we know alcohol will harm us but we know where we stand with it, each bottle tells us the content and we know our own limits etc, refering that back to the spin-ups if they were made very clear to be the hardest to make profit from and easiest to lose money from then im sure people woud still play them and still enjoy them but i believe a few non-clued up gamblers may think twice about spewing money on there.
In Response to Re: Spin Ups killing SKY Poker : where are these supermarkets ? Posted by stokefc
my very own asda and funnily enough it was the very same day of englands first match. Those in wales might be giving wine or champaign free samples the way the knockout stage is set.
In Response to Re: Spin Ups killing SKY Poker : thats all valid, my main issue is we know alcohol will harm us but we know where we stand with it, each bottle tells us the content and we know our own limits etc, refering that back to the spin-ups if they were made very clear to be the hardest to make profit from and easiest to lose money from then im sure people woud still play them and still enjoy them but i believe a few non-clued up gamblers may think twice about spewing money on there. Posted by jordz16
Knowing the limits, spin up being the hardest to make profit and easiest to lose money is already available bankroll management explains it all clear. Where general gambling comes in these are alot less costly than all the stuff that availible in sky vegas. you can see 6 hands for just over a 1/10 of you entry fee, but you'd be consistantly feeding the stuff run in sky vegas. I don't even think the most serious gamblers will be here in the first place, they normally playing things which offer hunders of pounds like main events, FOBT and the stuff you have in sky vegas.
If gamblig becomes a serious problem people can speak to gamble aware otherwise or learn to cut down on it themselves, no different to alcoholics really.
Craig, this kind of flippant comment can be upsetting, have you had any dealings or any knowledge on the subject?
I don't wish to pry in personal stuff, but as written it looks like a throwaway comment similar to "you are feeling depressed? Pull yourself together man."
The simple way of putting it is that spin ups are bad for those who want to make money in poker but good from a buissness point of view and it's the buissness part that i most important to sky itself, if it didn't make cash the site would have to close down. cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, gambling they all have the risks, you can speak to people if you want help but they can only give advice the user himself makes the decision.
If im honest i drifted way off my main point in this thread which was there is nothing wrong with spin ups, but i really dislike the idea of them being pushed onto newbies, even though it doesnt affect me much as an mtt player.
First up, I have twice asked Sky Poker if they have any plans to move these Spin Up tables away from the Main Cash Game Lobby. Both times they gave me an emphatic "no", & I communicated exactly this on here. I don't plan to ask them again, as they have made their position clear & I don't need telling 3 times, but I will send the thread Upstairs again. Posted by Tikay10
tikay im aware this isnt your fault, youre just the messenger, this isnt a dig at you but this is such a ridiculous answer from sky , theyre in the wrong place. its like putting sit & gos smack bang in the middle of the cash tab and then refusing to relocate them. You wouldnt put heads up tables udner a regular tab because that would be stupid but they would probably be less out of place than these spin ups..
how about an advamnced filter option to hide them off of the screen of people who phsyically select that option in filters, this would be incredibly easy to do and allows sky to kep pushing their new game format to all players except regs who have chosen to hide them
Some of these posts appear to be very caring for the rec, in the way of warnings.On the other hand, regs are always seeking out recs.
Its dog eat dog in the poker world and rightly so, nature of the game.The only requirement i see to play or not to play spin ups, is to be literate and to know the type of game it is.There seems to be a universal agreement on BR management as a priority but some folk have plenty of disposable income and arent that bothered, as in gambling.I f you have any sense in buisness and advertising you will know why the spin up tables are where they are.Ive had a peek at the spin up tables and they look very popular to me.Fuss about nothing.If you walk into a casino there is choice in what to play.
Comments
"Nobody can make money at Spin Ups".
How do you know that?
I don't have any access to the numbers, so I have exactly the same info as you. I would be pretty sure that it IS possible to make money at them, that some folks do make money at them, & that some players really enjoy them.
Let's move away from Spin Ups, & look at "regular" poker. Does everyone make money at that? Of course they don't, & you all know that. Most of us are net depositors, but we either kid ourselves, or just enjoy trying to make a few bob, &, most of all, enjoy ourselves.
Why is losing money at Spin Ups different to losing money at regular cash games, MTT's or SNG's? If all those who lost money stopped playing, poker would shut down within a few days....
"It's immoral", "it's like FOBT's".
Sorry, but poker players happily "scope" & bumhunt losing players, & eagerly sit at a table with a so-called "fish", look for "weak" tables & players. Is that immoral?
You never seen a high stakes cash game on this site with one "fish" & all the pros queuing up to take his money, then snap quitting when the mark leaves? Some players on this thread have done exactly that.
What about a Heads Up game & one player disco's? Do we all sit there & wait, or send the guy his money back?
It's poker, a gambling game, a game played for money. It's a bit rich to accuse Sky Poker of being ""immoral" for offering a game, when we as poker players exploit every single edge we can.
One person says Spin Ups are "immoral", & soon everyone is repeating it, & stating it as a fact.
There's nothing immoral or misleading about it.
I'm sorry that we don't see eye to eye on so many of the points made, but I can only speak as I find, & think. I don't really want to have a ruck, or fall out with you all, but I can't allow all these comments to go unanswered. Players are making stuff up, so I think I have the same right as you do to state my views.
It's when people make stuff up, & then others, sheep like, lazily copy those untruths, that I feel the need to bring some balance (and FACTS) to the thread.
At the end of the day, if you don't like spin ups, just don't play them. Complaining to get them removed won't achieve anything.
If gamblig becomes a serious problem people can speak to gamble aware otherwise or learn to cut down on it themselves, no different to alcoholics really.
If gamblig becomes a serious problem people can speak to gamble aware otherwise or learn to cut down on it themselves, no different to alcoholics really.