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Lawless Britain

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  • legascaaclegascaac Member Posts: 181
    It’s just an f in mess
    Kids get killed
    Far right jump on it cause mayhem
    Against mainly Muslim communities.
    Noo left wing folks are at it as well .. can you no all see this is what they’re trying to do .the right that is . find division.. that is
    And that silly man council boy
    Took the bait
    But there’s No chance off him ( that labour boy that says cut there throats )getting 3 years ,remember that he’s labours deputies mate ( 10 years for addressing a crowd with a microphone) .. at least .. disgraceful .. and could make things worse..
    Someone only got 20 months for five assault the day at Leeds court seems awfully lenient when caught on camera
    a now people that got 5 years for it in 1991 in the days off the casuals with no previous convictions to there names and that was for 2 and 3 assaults for both off them ..
    If you can jail an old man rightly so for 32 months for having a cosh /chib
    How on earth can you jail someone for 5 assaults for 20 months !!!
    to stir up more unrest and make things worse ?? Absolutely crazy
    justice must be even for all not totally one sided ..

    Sad Sad state off affairs this country is in

    but working class England is not getting a voice about there concerns ( mainly immigration)instead they’re being called racist .. for feeling marginalised and not listened to .. Europe’s even worse the right are gaining strength all over ..

    Problem no police on streets to deter crime, they’re now a service that’s never there apart from after the incident or to late for the hurt or attacked or murdered etc Needs to be a force and do things evenly and fairly irrespective whether your green blue white pink orange brown or black as we are a multicultural society.. or should be ..

    It’s to easy for people that want to do bad things,, to carry weapons and commit horrific crimes like Southport.. or that cop who killed that lassie and lots off other horrific crimes ..

    The
    cause mass underfunding in police by successive governments
    Just bad governance in general

    It’s just a f in mess


    Can anyone tell me if he didn’t enter a plea did that silly labour man did he get remanded??As it’s just a way off slowing down court proceedings usually or did he get bailed?

    Hopefully 🤞 🙏 things will get better soon..

    But what Edge said is how an awful lot off England feels

    And no a don’t have the answers






  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,543
    legascaac said:

    It’s just an f in mess
    Kids get killed
    Far right jump on it cause mayhem
    Against mainly Muslim communities.
    Noo left wing folks are at it as well .. can you no all see this is what they’re trying to do .the right that is . find division.. that is
    And that silly man council boy
    Took the bait
    But there’s No chance off him ( that labour boy that says cut there throats )getting 3 years ,remember that he’s labours deputies mate ( 10 years for addressing a crowd with a microphone) .. at least .. disgraceful .. and could make things worse..
    Someone only got 20 months for five assault the day at Leeds court seems awfully lenient when caught on camera
    a now people that got 5 years for it in 1991 in the days off the casuals with no previous convictions to there names and that was for 2 and 3 assaults for both off them ..
    If you can jail an old man rightly so for 32 months for having a cosh /chib
    How on earth can you jail someone for 5 assaults for 20 months !!!
    to stir up more unrest and make things worse ?? Absolutely crazy
    justice must be even for all not totally one sided ..

    Sad Sad state off affairs this country is in

    but working class England is not getting a voice about there concerns ( mainly immigration)instead they’re being called racist .. for feeling marginalised and not listened to .. Europe’s even worse the right are gaining strength all over ..

    Problem no police on streets to deter crime, they’re now a service that’s never there apart from after the incident or to late for the hurt or attacked or murdered etc Needs to be a force and do things evenly and fairly irrespective whether your green blue white pink orange brown or black as we are a multicultural society.. or should be ..

    It’s to easy for people that want to do bad things,, to carry weapons and commit horrific crimes like Southport.. or that cop who killed that lassie and lots off other horrific crimes ..

    The
    cause mass underfunding in police by successive governments
    Just bad governance in general

    It’s just a f in mess


    Can anyone tell me if he didn’t enter a plea did that silly labour man did he get remanded??As it’s just a way off slowing down court proceedings usually or did he get bailed?

    Hopefully 🤞 🙏 things will get better soon..

    But what Edge said is how an awful lot off England feels

    And no a don’t have the answers






    Councillor charged with encouraging violent disorder





    Suspended Labour councillor Ricky Jones has been remanded in custody after he was charged with encouraging violent disorder in connection with comments at a London counter-protest.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/credz9gl92yo
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,543
    Armchair thug jailed for Facebook posts urging rioters to attack asylum hotel


    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/armchair-thug-jailed-facebook-posts-143151594.html
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 168,777
    HAYSIE said:

    Armchair thug jailed for Facebook posts urging rioters to attack asylum hotel


    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/armchair-thug-jailed-facebook-posts-143151594.html



    Just think about it, what sort of person THINKS, let alone posts, stuff like this?

    And WHY would anyone think like that?





    “Set fire to all the f****** hotels full of the bastards”, adding “if that makes me racist, so be it.”
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,662
    Tikay10 said:

    Ok now a chance to prove that one law fits all, based on previous cases he should get in the region of 3 years.

    Lets see shall we. Although compared to the speed with which rioters are being sentenced September 6th seems somewhat slow.


    @TheEdge949


    I understand that the reason many cases are coming before the Courts so quickly is that they are pleading Guilty. If they plead Guilty, the Courts can deal with stuff instantly.

    In this case, the accused did not enter a plea, so perhaps that slows it down. I don't actually know what "did not enter a plea" means, other than the obvious. @Essexphil may be able to give us a steer on this.

    There are various reasons for not entering a plea. I'll give some examples. Please bear in mind that this is most certainly not legal advice.

    The backdrop is this. Because, like most things in life, there are advantages and disadvantages.

    If you plead Guilty then, rather obviously, you are more likely to be convicted. But there is a reduction in range of sentences to recognise the clear contrition, saving public money, less grief to victims as they don't have to be cross-examined etc.

    If you plead Not Guilty and are subsequently found guilty, then the longer you have pleaded Not Guilty, the bigger the likely penalty.

    If you do not enter a plea then it is taken as a Not Guilty plea, but with less bad effect than a Not Guilty plea.

    So-why go down the "no plea" route? 2 of the more common reasons are:-

    1. Not yet had specialist legal advice; or
    2. The Prosecution have not yet given sufficient detail as to what evidence they have in support of their case. A formal Not Guilty plea will inevitably cause delay. Not necessarily true for a No Plea

    The Press try and make out all this sort of stuff is black and white-it rarely is. Words and actions need context.

    1 other thing to mention is this. The Councillor has been "Remanded in Custody". That means he will be in Prison unless and until a Judge says otherwise or he is found Not Guilty at Trial. Which could be many months away-delay will most certainly not help him at this stage
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 168,777


    Thanks @Essexphil, I understand it a little better now.
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 168,777

    "The Press try and make out all this sort of stuff is black and white-it rarely is. Words and actions need context."




    That's a very important point, context & nuance must be taken into account.


    Which is why this sort of thinking is completely wrong;



    "If you can jail an old man rightly so for 32 months for having a cosh /chib
    How on earth can you jail someone for 5 assaults for 20 months !!!
    to stir up more unrest and make things worse ?? Absolutely crazy"



    It may look wrong from where we sit, but context, nuance, "previous", personal circumstances, co-operation, dependants, & all manner of other stuff must be taken into account.

    It's completely right that sentencing guidelines allow a degree of flexibility.
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,662
    edited August 10
    All true.

    The other important point is this.

    There is a world of difference between 1 person carrying a cosh, and being 1 of 1000 people tooled up for what amounts to a joint venture of a mob (left or right wing) whose primary object is to cause harm.

    Getting back to the Councillor. There is a world of difference between saying something stupid and/or clumsy that no-one is likely to act on, and actively encouraging people to string up the nearest racist.

    For the avoidance of doubt, not defending his actions either way. And don't know which of those 2 things applies.

    PS. The other important point is this-how likely is someone to reoffend? To use the M25 protestors as an example, doing the exact same things 3 times between conviction and sentencing is a spectacularly stupid thing to do.
  • TheEdge949TheEdge949 Member Posts: 5,649
    @Essexphil

    Cheers buddy, I was hoping you might give us the benefit of your insight.

    Makes things much clearer.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,543
    Tory councillor’s wife could face 18 months in prison over racial hatred charge


    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/tory-councillor-wife-charged-stirring-091521414.html
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 168,777
    HAYSIE said:

    Tory councillor’s wife could face 18 months in prison over racial hatred charge


    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/tory-councillor-wife-charged-stirring-091521414.html


    @HAYSIE



    "Her application for bail was refused. She was remanded into custody and will next appear at Nottingham Crown Court on Monday".



    So she's not having a very nice weekend, but at least it'll help prepare her for going to prison once her Court Case is held.

    I wonder if she's now re-considering her words, or realising that actions have consequences? I'm neither mean nor vindictive, but a year or two in Prison would do her & her like a world of good, & maybe they'll think twice in future before running their mouth with hate-speech.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,543
    Tikay10 said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Tory councillor’s wife could face 18 months in prison over racial hatred charge


    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/tory-councillor-wife-charged-stirring-091521414.html


    @HAYSIE



    "Her application for bail was refused. She was remanded into custody and will next appear at Nottingham Crown Court on Monday".



    So she's not having a very nice weekend, but at least it'll help prepare her for going to prison once her Court Case is held.

    I wonder if she's now re-considering her words, or realising that actions have consequences? I'm neither mean nor vindictive, but a year or two in Prison would do her & her like a world of good, & maybe they'll think twice in future before running their mouth with hate-speech.
    Prison will come as a massive shock to many of these people.
    It might even change some of them for the better.
  • VespaPXVespaPX Member Posts: 12,313
    Time to dust off my "Demolition Man" DVD to see where we're heading
  • goldongoldon Member Posts: 8,985
    You won't like the "Answer " but we all go there in the end..... hic!
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,543
    Thousands of anti-racism protesters demonstrate outside Reform UK headquarters


    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/thousands-anti-racism-protesters-demonstrate-180423791.html
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,543
    UK riots latest: Thousands in anti-racist rallies across country as Tory councillor’s wife appears in court



    https://uk.yahoo.com/news/southport-stabbing-latest-multiple-casualties-125827013.html
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