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DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....

DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
edited February 2010 in Poker Chat

Right then, the form of poker I play least! I have abit of time to practise and build up some experience in this type of game. Just played a wee DYM, just a 5r, n came third. I very nearly blew it though, I read so many posts on here regarding DYM's, I wondered if the guys who play em constantly can helkp me with a few scenarios I encountered, and also, just offer genral advice.

The first one....we're on the bubble, the highest stack is myself with 3,600, the lowst is just below 3k, so theres absolutely nothing in it.


Situation 1

Blinds 100/200, I have ace 6 in the small blind. I raise 3xBB and the flop comes 6, 5, 5 2 diamonds. I bet 800, and the fella goes all in. If I put him on the fd and 2 overs, do I pass here? as after all the prize for 3rd is the same as 1st? - Had him on a QK diamonds sort of hand. Anyway I passed, as i still had over 2k left.

Situation 2

Still the bubble, blinds 150,300, shortstack has 365, and shoves the button obv. The small blind FOLDS! SUUUREEEEELLLLYYYYY he calls with any 2 here? - I know the answer here just want it confirming. Anyway the shortie doubled.

Situation 3

My nxt BB, the shortie has 685. - Blinds 150 / 300 - He shoves again, The sb folds, AGAIN, grr, I have 6-2 and a stack of 1,800ish, with 300 invested. Do I call here??? I did, and won.....


The more I play the more I'll get used to these sort of situations, as I get used to 3rd being worth the same as 1st. Any help much appreciated, Ive made no secret of hating this format, but the conventinal sng format of top 2 getting paid has an inbalanced pay out, 3rd in a dym is worth more than 2nd in a normal SNG.

Thanx for any help, DOHH




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Comments

  • phil12ukphil12uk Member Posts: 2,856
    edited January 2010
    In Response to DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    Right then, the form of poker I play least! I have abit of time to practise and build up some experience in this type of game. Just played a wee DYM, just a 5r, n came third. I very nearly blew it though, I read so many posts on here regarding DYM's, I wondered if the guys who play em constantly can helkp me with a few scenarios I encountered, and also, just offer genral advice. The first one....we're on the bubble, the highest stack is myself with 3,600, the lowst is just below 3k, so theres absolutely nothing in it. Situation 1 Blinds 100/200, I have ace 6 in the small blind. I raise 3xBB and the flop comes 6, 5, 5 2 diamonds. I bet 800, and the fella goes all in. If I put him on the fd and 2 overs, do I pass here? as after all the prize for 3rd is the same as 1st? - Had him on a QK diamonds sort of hand. Anyway I passed, as i still had over 2k left. Situation 2 Still the bubble, blinds 150,300, shortstack has 365, and shoves the button obv. The small blind FOLDS! SUUUREEEEELLLLYYYYY he calls with any 2 here? - I know the answer here just want it confirming. Anyway the shortie doubled. Situation 3 My nxt BB, the shortie has 685. - Blinds 150 / 300 - He shoves again, The sb folds, AGAIN, grr, I have 6-2 and a stack of 1,800ish, with 300 invested. Do I call here??? I did, and won..... The more I play the more I'll get used to these sort of situations, as I get used to 3rd being worth the same as 1st. Any help much appreciated, Ive made no secret of hating this format, but the conventinal sng format of top 2 getting paid has an inbalanced pay out, 3rd in a dym is worth more than 2nd in a normal SNG. Thanx for any help, DOHH
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH

    I have all the answers u need m8...........but ur my official competition so im staying quiet ;) lol

    Only joking - I'll have a proper read and give u my thoughts

    Congrats again and lets have a good, fun battle - Phil

  • phil12ukphil12uk Member Posts: 2,856
    edited January 2010
    You've honestly done nothing wrong on any of the 3 plays. I have played a lot of sngs and would have done the same as u in all 3 cases.


    This isnt a bad beat post below - but could / would u have called in ??? position Dohhhhhhhh.......I scratched my head about it! :)
    VILLAINS Small blind  150.00 150.00 2290.00
    phil12uk Big blind  300.00 450.00 1092.50
      Your hole cards
    • Q
    • K
         
    ??? Call  300.00 750.00 5495.00
    drawbag Fold     
    VILLAINS Fold     
    phil12uk All-in  1092.50 1842.50 0.00
    ??? Call  1092.50 2935.00 4402.50
    phil12uk Show
    • Q
    • K
       
    ??? Show
    • 2
    • 8
       
    Flop
       
    • A
    • 2
    • 6
         
    Turn
       
    • 9
         
    River
       
    • 5
         
    ??? Win Pair of 2s 2935.00  7337.50
  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited January 2010


    Yeh Im all in there, hes limp called an all in with 8 high?  -  U play pretty high level SNG's dnt u??? lol

    The main one I was in 2 minds about was the ace 6, flopping tp tk. If its a normal MTT, I have absolutely no regard for any type of bubble (might be different if/when I play bigger buy ins, like, alot bigger buy ins. So situations like this are new to me.

    I'll probli see you at the £22 + sngs over the next week or so as I get used to it, thanx for the reply.

    DOHH

  • silentbobsilentbob Member Posts: 2,137
    edited January 2010
    In Response to DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    Right then, the form of poker I play least! I have abit of time to practise and build up some experience in this type of game. Just played a wee DYM, just a 5r, n came third. I very nearly blew it though, I read so many posts on here regarding DYM's, I wondered if the guys who play em constantly can helkp me with a few scenarios I encountered, and also, just offer genral advice. The first one....we're on the bubble, the highest stack is myself with 3,600, the lowst is just below 3k, so theres absolutely nothing in it. Situation 1 Blinds 100/200, I have ace 6 in the small blind. I raise 3xBB and the flop comes 6, 5, 5 2 diamonds. I bet 800, and the fella goes all in. If I put him on the fd and 2 overs, do I pass here? as after all the prize for 3rd is the same as 1st? - Had him on a QK diamonds sort of hand. Anyway I passed, as i still had over 2k left. Situation 2 Still the bubble, blinds 150,300, shortstack has 365, and shoves the button obv. The small blind FOLDS! SUUUREEEEELLLLYYYYY he calls with any 2 here? - I know the answer here just want it confirming. Anyway the shortie doubled. Situation 3 My nxt BB, the shortie has 685. - Blinds 150 / 300 - He shoves again, The sb folds, AGAIN, grr, I have 6-2 and a stack of 1,800ish, with 300 invested. Do I call here??? I did, and won..... The more I play the more I'll get used to these sort of situations, as I get used to 3rd being worth the same as 1st. Any help much appreciated, Ive made no secret of hating this format, but the conventinal sng format of top 2 getting paid has an inbalanced pay out, 3rd in a dym is worth more than 2nd in a normal SNG. Thanx for any help, DOHH
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH
    Hi DOHHHHHHH

    I know you're an aggressive player by nature so the DYM probably go against your normal play a bit. As you've stated, 3rd is worth the same as 1st (unless you're really bothered about the league points) so in that respect you kinda have to leave your normal playing mentality behind to an extent.

    FWIW, here's my views:

    1 - I assume by your description it's folded round to you so I see no issue with the raise pre as you're probably ahead. However, once he shoves after you bet out on the flop I'm getting outta there PDQ. No need to stay and fight even if you are actually still ahead. As you say, you've still 2k behind so plenty to fight on with.

    2 - YES, YES, YES, YES, YES. Imo, both the blinds should be calling here regardless of what they hold. The only time I might not call from the SB here is if I've maybe only got ~600/700 left myself cos if shorty busts here it's mission accomplished. I'm assuming from your description that the SB had a bigger stack than this so absolutely should've called.

    3 - I think the call is right here. As long as you're live you're never gonna be that far behind & even if you lose the hand you've still got 1500 behind.

    Jay
  • loonytoonsloonytoons Member Posts: 4,270
    edited January 2010
    Why DYM's there are loads of £11+ 6 seater sng's, where they pay 1st(70%) and 2nd(30%) these are more aggressive to your style of play because your trying to win, not just survival by finishing in the top half, just a thought. ps i dont think its how much profit you show, its the way you play that is more important to the mentors, so in these formats you could show more poker moves so to speak 
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 169,112
    edited January 2010

    Doh,

    Firstly, I will reply to your PM tomorrow. I know you said you did not need a reply, but I'd like to. But I'm too tired to tackle it tonight.

    OK, those DYM questions.

    You don't need "how to play a poker hand" advice from me or anyone else I suspect. But tactics in a DYM are something else completely.

    DYM's are COMPLETELY different to regular SNG's, or even Tournament poker.

    6 start, & 3 get paid, & they all get paid the same. So it's like a Super-Sat. Do NOT try to win the thing.

    You only need to focus or get involved when there are FOUR players left. To get involved earlier makes no sense, & in any event, it's probable that the early-paced LAG's will do your job for you & bust themselves or others.

    So, 4 handed, NOW we play. Assuming level stacks (unlikely), just get your money in first (shove, the Blinds will be big) to pay the rent. Watch the others stack-sizes & the Button Position with great care, & see who is likely to shove next. Basically, just steal enough to keep out of trouble, & let the others do the work. Sometimes, you will need to make those Hero Calls when Mr Shortie shoves, but you need no advice from me on that stuff, you know the score.

    Finally, remember that to be "reasonably" profitable in DYM's, you really need to cash in 7 out of every 10. 6 out of 10 only shows a 5% ROI (approx, & net of Reg Fees), so 7 out of 10 is your minimum Target if you go the DYM Route. 
  • Seagull158Seagull158 Member Posts: 1,100
    edited January 2010
    In Response to DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:

    Doh, according to the rules you have to play S&Gs but it doesnt say they have to be DYMs. You can play DYM and go for top 3 every time or you can play other S&Gs and g FTW.
  • Spike2120Spike2120 Member Posts: 112
    edited January 2010
    DYM's is the way I came into poker, here are some tips to playing them.

    Tikay is right that you don't really play til you get to the last four with only having to come third to make maximum profit off a DYM then you can let the LAG players play their hands and play themselves out, if you don't play for a while or only pick up a few blinds thats fine, just think in STT's that there are not that many chips in play so all you need is 1 big pot and your back up with the leader.

    When it gets to the bubble, most people play really tight this is where you can use, with care, your tight image you have shown throughout the rest of the tournament to steal blinds, which at this point are substancial to your stack, just be careful not to get trapped, but as long as you have your reads on players by this point you should be fine, plus I know this area is more your way of play.

    Good Luck on them and Good Luck in TP mate

    Spike2120
  • BlackFish3BlackFish3 Member Posts: 2,418
    edited January 2010
    Ok doh... some general dym tips:
    1. you lose a lot of power in dym games because you have to beat a win rate of 55% to make a profit... so always keep this number in mind... for these reasons i think getting it all in preflop when you have more than 20BBish with AK or even AKs is not profitable. KK and AA obviously, QQ becomes tough and JJ is to me a fold.
    2. as before ive said you lose a lot of power so i think dym becomes a much more passive game, reraising without JJ+ is problematic because if you do it with AK, get called, miss the flop and c bet... get called then you can easily lose a chunk of your stack and without the potential to reload this is deadly. the game is about chip preservation so that you have fold equity for the shove stage.
    3. when you have less than 10BB always shove and dont raise or limp.
    4. be careful shoving limpers because a lot of players have a tendency to limp call very light at the end stages of a dym.
    5. i find limping in SB or checking in BB with big aces is fine in dym but obviously just throw them away more readily in a multi way pot.
    6. chip stacks are key... if you raise someones BB who has about 10BB then you can expect them to shove a % of the time so tighten up your raising range... middle stacks though bully bully bully and passive big stacks but not calling station big stacks.
    7. chip accumulation... ok some people say basically sit out the first couple blind levels but i think instead you should be slowly trying to accumulate chips using your post flop advantage so that you have the potential to survive a coin flip later on.
    8. the power of the min raise... min raise acts as a pot builder but also establishes your control in the hand (a psychological raise)... ooo he raised he must have a hand sort of thinking... so min raising in position with suited cons can be very potent and a decent % of the time everyone plays so tight they just fold. this can also be done with a wide range in the SB as it allows you to C bet very cheaply and pick up lots of small pots allowing for successful chip accumulation.

    hope these tips helps buddy... let me know if u need any explained or want to debate anything
    much love x
  • IRISHROVERIRISHROVER Member Posts: 7,606
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    Ok doh... some general dym tips: 1. you lose a lot of power in dym games because you have to beat a win rate of 55% to make a profit... so always keep this number in mind... for these reasons i think getting it all in preflop when you have more than 20BBish with AK or even AKs is not profitable. KK and AA obviously, QQ becomes tough and JJ is to me a fold. 2. as before ive said you lose a lot of power so i think dym becomes a much more passive game, reraising without JJ+ is problematic because if you do it with AK, get called, miss the flop and c bet... get called then you can easily lose a chunk of your stack and without the potential to reload this is deadly. the game is about chip preservation so that you have fold equity for the shove stage. 3. when you have less than 10BB always shove and dont raise or limp. 4. be careful shoving limpers because a lot of players have a tendency to limp call very light at the end stages of a dym. 5. i find limping in SB or checking in BB with big aces is fine in dym but obviously just throw them away more readily in a multi way pot. 6. chip stacks are key... if you raise someones BB who has about 10BB then you can expect them to shove a % of the time so tighten up your raising range... middle stacks though bully bully bully and passive big stacks but not calling station big stacks. 7. chip accumulation... ok some people say basically sit out the first couple blind levels but i think instead you should be slowly trying to accumulate chips using your post flop advantage so that you have the potential to survive a coin flip later on. 8. the power of the min raise... min raise acts as a pot builder but also establishes your control in the hand (a psychological raise)... ooo he raised he must have a hand sort of thinking... so min raising in position with suited cons can be very potent and a decent % of the time everyone plays so tight they just fold. this can also be done with a wide range in the SB as it allows you to C bet very cheaply and pick up lots of small pots allowing for successful chip accumulation. hope these tips helps buddy... let me know if u need any explained or want to debate anything much love x
    Posted by BlackFish3

    mmmm so you do have a bit of poker skill in you lol !
  • BlackFish3BlackFish3 Member Posts: 2,418
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!.... : mmmm so you do have a bit of poker skill in you lol !
    Posted by IRISHROVER
    errrm eh irish? you think i was a complete donk?
  • loonytoonsloonytoons Member Posts: 4,270
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!.... : mmmm so you do have a bit of poker skill in you lol !
    Posted by IRISHROVER
    probably copied it from another forum lol hehe
  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8 Member Posts: 6,228
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!.... : probably copied it from another forum lol hehe
    Posted by loonytoons
    LOL, that's cruel
  • IRISHROVERIRISHROVER Member Posts: 7,606
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!.... : errrm eh irish? you think i was a complete donk?
    Posted by BlackFish3
    now when you say donk,

    i presume you mean donkey like in poker calling station,

    i would never say something like that about one of my mates,

    p.s. but in facial appearance you do look a bit like mr ed .

    lucky for me you are far to young to know who  mr ed was  lol.
  • BlackFish3BlackFish3 Member Posts: 2,418
    edited January 2010
    lol ouch loony thanks a lot... all my own tips though :) i wont bother next time if this is the response im going to get ;) haha irish i just googled mr ed... thanks.
  • IRISHROVERIRISHROVER Member Posts: 7,606
    edited January 2010

    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:

    lol ouch loony thanks a lot... all my own tips though :) i wont bother next time if this is the response im going to get ;) haha irish i just googled mr ed... thanks.
    Posted by BlackFish3

    n1,

    hey i tried out your tips today seriously they worked for me ty,

    and plzzz do bother ,



     

  • PokerPartyPokerParty Member Posts: 84
    edited January 2010
    What a great thread, this is what a community is all about :-)
  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited January 2010

    Ive not played any sng's today guys, Was up till 5.30am this morning playing a DYM with blackfish (thanx 4 the post m8). I only went to bed then as my Dad was up for work and needed the lappy. So Iv been struggling abit today, played the ME, took 3 bounties, and played the deepstack omaha tourny this aft which, I WON! HA!

    Hardly good preperation for the biggest NLHE competition Im ever likely to play in like, lol, but thankfully I have time on my side.

    Early concerns about my comp not being able to handle more than 2 games at once have changed, watching the guys allocate their time tonight, I think there's plenty enough time to get the 10 sngs in, playing 2 at a time all night in 1 particular night, is easily possible. This will probably be if I bust early in the main event one night, If I go deep in all 3, then this is kool :)

    Enter 2 each night at ten to 11 to squeeze as much time in as possible on my beloved cash tables :)

    Anyway, I feel like I'm writing a diary here, when all I came on to say was thanx for all your replies, and tomorrow, midday till midnight, is gonna be solid poker, with loads n loads of sngs, so If u guys can just glance in there will be some new hands to look at.

    Thanx again, DOHH
  • elsadogelsadog Member Posts: 5,677
    edited January 2010

    JJ take a look at a post on blonde re. stt strategy. It's by wardonkey (one of the best stt players) and you will find it useful. If you search on blonde you should find it.

    psst ....... If you ask Tikay nicely he might give you a link to it.


    Woof!

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 169,112
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: DOHHH's TP preperation sit n go specific thread!....:
    JJ take a look at a post on blonde re. stt strategy. It's by wardonkey (one of the best stt players) and you will find it useful. If you search on blonde you should find it. psst ....... If you ask Tikay nicely he might give you a link to it. Woof!
    Posted by elsadog
    I cannot Post a Link to it - the Mods would have me shot!

    But I will ensure Dohx7 gets to see it. I'll either copy it across to here, or send him a PM telling him where he can find it.

    Gotta love this thread.
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