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Diary of a determined player

peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
Hi all,

Those who've played here for several years will already know me, and will also know my previous diary on here "diary of a fledgling player". That diary documented my wins and losses, but my attitude was extremely lazy and I was not developing my game as I should have done.

Now though, personal circumstances have meant that I need something to focus on in my life, and I have picked poker. So, as of 1st September I reset my sharkscope statistics and I am going to try and develop my game; who knows where this journey will take me.

This diary won't just be a list of my daily results this time either. I'll be posting questions, hand histories, and moans (probably).

What am I doing to learn? I've bought Daniel Negreanu's masterclass and am working through the course. Once complete, I intend to start working with the tools on the Advanced Poker Training website. That's in addition to playing, of course.

I actually played my first live tournament today, here are some random notes/thoughts.

- I felt extremely nervous at the start and played very tight. This sounds crazy, but it took me a while to figure out basic things such as who was next to act. Obviously I know the game, but there's a lot you take for granted online such as being told when it's your turn, and always knowing exactly how much is in the pot. It took me a good hour to get used to that, and I am still not fully comfortable yet. I suppose that will come with experience. It's also worth noting that it was a nine handed MTT, and I am used to playing six max.

- I actually started quite well, despite folding everything for the first orbit. After three orbits, I had almost doubled my stack. Given that no-one was knocked out at that point, I think I was the chip leader.

- It all "went to pot" when I made a panic move after around 70 minutes of play. Blinds were 500/1000, opponent raised from middle position to 3000. I called with KTo in the cut off. Flop was very dry, no high cards. Check-check. He bet 6000 on the turn (another brick card). For some reason, I made a crazy move and re-raised to 12,200. I honestly don't know why I did that. It was just the pressure of people watching me I suppose! He called. He then raised 3000 on the river to which I folded. Really horrific play by me, and I lost a decent chunk of my stack.

- Eventually knocked out of the tournament in around 25th place out of 50. Shoved under 10 BB's with AQo. Called by another AQo and 22. Two's held.

- A fun experience. I need to learn to take my time a bit more though. Even the basics are difficult in that high-pressure environment. There was once instance where I won a pot, and the person who'd folded to me asked to see my cards. I said no, and he got very angry which was discouraging.

Anyway, I have rambled on long enough now. If you got this far, I'm impressed. ;)
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Comments

  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    I have an interesting hand that I would like some feedback on please.
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    GREGSTERSmall blind50.0050.001700.00
    peter27Big blind100.00150.001600.00
    Your hole cards
    • 7
    • 6
    benclargCall100.00250.008875.00
    mozzi128Fold
    weekesFold
    GREGSTERCall50.00300.001650.00
    peter27Check
    Flop
    • 8
    • 5
    • 7
    GREGSTERBet150.00450.001500.00
    peter27Call150.00600.001450.00
    benclargRaise525.001125.008350.00
    GREGSTERAll-in1500.002625.000.00
    peter27Fold
    benclargCall1125.003750.007225.00
    GREGSTERShow
    • 9
    • J
    benclargShow
    • 5
    • K
    Turn
    • K
    River
    • 9
    benclargWinTwo Pairs, Kings and 5s3750.0010975.00
    With two callers pre-flop, I felt like my check was probably correct. However, after the flop, I'm not sure my call was the correct play. Thoughts? Sorry if this is obvious to some of you.

    As an entirely separate question, I read that if you're going to raise on the button, you should always 3-bet. Would you agree with that? I've always tended to 3-bet at the lower blind levels, but then 2-bet at higher blind levels.
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 88,276

    ^^^^

    Morning @peter27

    I'll leave analysis of that hand to the proper players, but I think it might aid feedback if they knew what sort of format you were playing. We would play very different ranges in, say, a slow deepstack MTT, for example, compared to a Turbo SNG or DYM.

    PS - this might sound an odd question if the answer is "no", but are you the peter27 who specialises in punting on F1?
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    Good point. It was a turbo bounty hunter.

    Yes, that's me. :p
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 88,276

    Yup, thought as much. The style of writing was the clue, though brighter folk than me might have deduced it from the username.....
  • JacquelynJacquelyn Member Posts: 254
    I don't necessarily think you played the hand above wrong at all...

    BH's tend to be very aggressive as players are actively trying to take people out to increase their prize. This means they gamble more.

    PF play is fine.

    Flop is where is gets interesting - if you had re-raised rather than calling then both opponents likely fold. This is what you could and would change in hindsight, however with mid pair, bad kicker and only a straight draw, calling the 150 is pretty standard IMO.

    Once you only called, you did the right thing by folding to the all in IMO (regardless of the fact you were ahead of them both - I think it's fair to assume that in most hands with this betting you are behind with mid pair and bad kicker (allbeit with the draw as insurance).

    I'm no expert in BH's but i think i likely would have done exactly what you did - don't know if that's good or bad for you haha!

  • LARSON7LARSON7 Member Posts: 4,441
    edited September 2018
    Hi Peter,

    Pre flop can only but check.

    Otf we Flop the world with a pair and an open ender. When gregster bets half pot we should be raising, preferably all in given our stack size, say they have a hand like 10-10 through to aa, we are slightly ahead.

    When you jam, they can also fold a lot as well.

    Not to mention we are short stacked and need to get going to kick on and try and do well in the tourney. This is a great spot for us when we flop so much equity.
  • MattBatesMattBates Member Posts: 3,802
    peter27 said:



    As an entirely separate question, I read that if you're going to raise on the button, you should always 3-bet. Would you agree with that? I've always tended to 3-bet at the lower blind levels, but then 2-bet at higher blind levels.

    When you say 3-bet I assume you mean 3x raise rather than 3bet.

    What was the reasoning behind what you read? I don't know why you would be wanting to be raising a larger size on the button (where we have positional advantage). Although I am not certain if that is what is being said or not.

    There are so many factors with 3bet sizings, we need to be thinking about what we are trying to achieve with our sizings. Early on then 3x as standard will be fine but I wouldn't be just raising a set size as you get deeper as there are a lot of factors to think about. Stack sizes, position, stack to pot ratios. etc etc.
  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr Member Posts: 7,488
    LARSON7 said:

    Hi Peter,

    Pre flop can only but check.

    Otf we Flop the world with a pair and an open ender. When gregster bets half pot we should be raising, preferably all in giving our stack size, say they have a hand like 10-10 through to aa, we are slightly ahead.

    When you jam, they can also fold a lot as well.

    Not to mention we are short stacked and need to get going to kick on and try and do well in the tourney. This is a great spot for us when we flop so much equity.

    Who in this hand is realistically likely to have TT - AA?

    Jam flop. As played you've made it kinda tricky for yourself, though I still might be inclined to call it off and go for the spin with what should be pretty good equity even 3way.
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    edited September 2018
    Interesting that both Larson and "Harry" said jam the flop.

    Larson, I do agree with Harry. Is it likely that either opponent would have TT - AA given that they didn't raise pre?

    For my own knowledge, what sort of hand equity would I have had on the flop there?
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    @MattBates Yes, 3x raise.

    I'm not sure but it sounded strange to me which is why I posted it here. 3x at the start of the tournament, less in the middle/late stages tends to be my approach.
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    How was this hand as played (from a bounty hunter)?
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    peter27Small blind150.00150.004410.00
    jack100Big blind300.00450.009670.00
    Your hole cards
    • J
    • J
    SAK65Raise900.001350.007075.00
    steveyseeFold
    stuart43Fold
    SLANLEATFold
    peter27Call750.002100.003660.00
    jack100Fold
    Flop
    • 6
    • 3
    • 7
    peter27All-in3660.005760.000.00
    SAK65Fold
    peter27Muck
    peter27Win2100.002100.00
    peter27Return3660.000.005760.00
    The jam on the flop was because I was a little spooked by the 3x raise UTG. I barely even made the call pre-flop. In hindsight, I think the jam was a little rash. Looking back on it, I don't think the opponent was likely to have hit that flop given his position. Would love to get everyone's thoughts.
  • LARSON7LARSON7 Member Posts: 4,441
    edited September 2018
    Peter, it's unlikely they will have 1010+, the point is even if they did ( or no matter what they have) you have great equity.

    With JJ and and 15bb in the SB you want to be jamming here versus this players 3 x open.
  • MattBatesMattBates Member Posts: 3,802
    peter27 said:

    @MattBates Yes, 3x raise.

    I'm not sure but it sounded strange to me which is why I posted it here. 3x at the start of the tournament, less in the middle/late stages tends to be my approach.

    The key is knowing their rationale before we can say if it is strange or otherwise.
  • JacquelynJacquelyn Member Posts: 254
    edited September 2018
    LARSON7 said:

    Hi Peter,



    say they have a hand like 10-10 through to aa, we are slightly ahead.

    Not entirely true... TT is 55%+ v the pair and open ender on the flop (i guess due to a 9 giving them better straight). AA is 53% too.

    Even v k8 they are 53% favourite.
  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr Member Posts: 7,488
    Jacquelyn said:

    LARSON7 said:

    Hi Peter,



    say they have a hand like 10-10 through to aa, we are slightly ahead.

    Not entirely true... TT is 55%+ v the pair and open ender on the flop (i guess due to a 9 giving them better straight). AA is 53% too.

    Even v k8 they are 53% favourite.
    Ah the old 5 7 8 9 T straight.
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 88,276

    Jacquelyn said:

    LARSON7 said:

    Hi Peter,



    say they have a hand like 10-10 through to aa, we are slightly ahead.

    Not entirely true... TT is 55%+ v the pair and open ender on the flop (i guess due to a 9 giving them better straight). AA is 53% too.

    Even v k8 they are 53% favourite.

    Ah the old 5 7 8 9 T straight.

    Steady on, that's copyrighted by Rich Orford.
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    Haha!
    LARSON7 said:

    With JJ and and 15bb in the SB you want to be jamming here versus this players 3 x open.

    That seems very loose to me. I tend to be more of a cautious player, but I do get that we're short stacked, and that this is a bounty hunter.
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    This game is so frustrating at times. I'm trying my best to improve, but it's hard to tell if I am or not due to having such a small sample size right now (78 games played). The sharkscope graph is showing a worrying trend though ..

    What I can say is that I am thinking about each hand way more than I ever would have done in the past.

    Anyhow, here are a couple more hands I would like advice on.

    1) The very early stages of a bounty hunter. Is there any way I could have got off this hand? I'm thinking that maybe my pre-flop raise should have been higher with so many players behind. Also think that perhaps my check-call on the flop was incorrect, however, I would always struggle to bet in that spot with KK showing. What would the correct play have been?
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    messygerSmall blind10.0010.001055.00
    peter27Big blind20.0030.001990.00
    Your hole cards
    • J
    • A
    GolfphillCall20.0050.002190.00
    MaipenlaiFold
    barfoot12Call20.0070.002395.00
    steve748Call20.0090.002090.00
    messygerCall10.00100.001045.00
    peter27Raise60.00160.001930.00
    GolfphillCall60.00220.002130.00
    barfoot12Call60.00280.002335.00
    steve748Call60.00340.002030.00
    messygerCall60.00400.00985.00
    Flop
    • 7
    • K
    • K
    messygerCheck
    peter27Check
    GolfphillCheck
    barfoot12Check
    steve748Bet20.00420.002010.00
    messygerFold
    peter27Call20.00440.001910.00
    GolfphillCall20.00460.002110.00
    barfoot12Call20.00480.002315.00
    Turn
    • A
    peter27Check
    GolfphillCheck
    barfoot12Check
    steve748Bet360.00840.001650.00
    peter27Call360.001200.001550.00
    GolfphillFold
    barfoot12Fold
    River
    • 3
    peter27Check
    steve748All-in1650.002850.000.00
    peter27All-in1550.004400.000.00
    steve748Unmatched bet100.004300.00100.00
    peter27Show
    • J
    • A
    steve748Show
    • K
    • Q
    steve748WinThree Kings4300.004400.00
  • peter27peter27 Member Posts: 1,605
    2) General advice required about this hand from a freezeout MTT. Do you think the fold was correct? Did I make any major mistakes? In this situation, where you have a "four card flush" post-flop, I've always been unsure if we should be looking to get our money in or not.
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    MadStadFanSmall blind75.0075.001607.50
    CenSwordBig blind150.00225.003402.00
    Your hole cards
    • J
    • A
    peter27Raise330.00555.002803.00
    p-nutFold
    adelfcFold
    MadStadFanFold
    CenSwordCall180.00735.003222.00
    Flop
    • 6
    • 3
    • 5
    CenSwordCheck
    peter27Bet425.001160.002378.00
    CenSwordCall425.001585.002797.00
    Turn
    • 3
    CenSwordCheck
    peter27Bet1000.002585.001378.00
    CenSwordCall1000.003585.001797.00
    River
    • 8
    CenSwordBet1500.005085.00297.00
    peter27Fold
    CenSwordMuck
    CenSwordWin3585.003882.00
    CenSwordReturn1500.000.005382.00
  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr Member Posts: 7,488
    edited September 2018
    The first AJ hand....

    The raise pre that size is utterly pointless. There's gonna be a clear domino effect meaning you've bloated the pot yet still have it multiway with a hand that is decent but not great.

    What are you hoping to achieve with a raise? Are you trying to take it down there and then? Trying to get it heads up to the flop? Either way, if you're gonna raise in this spot then it needs to be a lot more.

    In the first level of a BH, out of position facing multiple limps, I think I'd just check with AJo. It's a good ace but there's no reason to go apeshit with it. But if you do wanna raise it though, it needs to be much much more than what you did.

    Flop is just a fold.

    Turn is a fold.

    River is a fold.

    On that flop multi-way I'm not putting another chip in the pot without significant improvement.

    When you check call it off on the river, what on earth do you think he's gonna show up with? Play through the story of the hand (over-limp call pre, min bet flop, takes off on turn and jams river), he's gonna have bluffs probably 0% of the time, and there are no missed draws or anything. People can do crazy things in BHs but I'd be surprised if he's jamming something like AT/A9 on the river.

    When players play passive pre flop and then take off on future streets, that's usually a good indication of the strength of their hand.

    There is no reason to go broke in that hand.

    Ps; it's not loose in the slightest to 3bet jam JJ for 15bb vs a 3x raise.
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