You need to be logged in to your Sky Poker account above to post discussions and comments.

You might need to refresh your page afterwards.

Effects Of Brexit.

1606163656695

Comments

  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    edited December 2021
    Essexphil said:

    Here are some really simple questions for you.

    They will follow a familiar format. Yes. Or No. Or, you could just ignore them, of course.

    1. Do you believe that the UK Government does lots of good things? Yes/No
    2. Do you believe the people who run the EU do lots of good things? Yes/no
    3. Do you believe the UK Government do quite a few things that, regardless of individual views on Brexit/the EU are bad? Yes/no
    4. Do you believe the EU officials do quite a few things that, regardless of individual views on Brexit/the EU are bad? Yes/no
    5. Do you believe that the UK Government sometimes says things that are deliberately misleading in order to further its own aims? Yes/No
    6. Do you believe that the EU leaders sometimes say things that are deliberately misleading in order to further its own aims? Yes/No

    My answers, to every 1 of those questions, is Yes.
    Your thousands of posts suggest you genuinely believe the answers to 1, 4 & 6 are No.

    Which is why I struggle to think of anyone who so consistently praises everything done by Continental Europe, while simultaneously seeking to be constantly and consistently negative in relation to the UK.

    And why I would rather read a Conspiracy thread.


    Quite funny.

    Amazon reviews of Mark Francois’s self-published Brexit Book are in and they are...mixed




    Yes I’m looking for a book... it’s called Spartan Victory by Mark Francois


    if you are approached by a Mark Francois trying to flog his book it's a bargain 49p and makes wonderful firewood


    MARK FRANCOIS launches his colouring book:




    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/amazon-reviews-of-mark-francois-s-self-published-brexit-book-are-in-and-they-are-mixed/ar-AARyKha?ocid=msedgntp
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,783
    HAYSIE said:
    That rather depends on how you define "trade". That article uses a rather different definition on "trade" than any normal person.

    The article calls it "trade"-but what it really is is "international trade". 2 entirely separate things.

    We have left an international trading bloc, to become our own, (more) independent, sovereign nation. As a result, in news that should surprise precisely nobody, we export less, and import less, particularly to the EU. But, of itself, this is largely meaningless.

    France swaps lots of its products with Germany, "creating" international trade. Most of the EU are not islands-this happens. The UK is consuming more of its own product than before, thus importing and exporting less.

    None of this "data" is of any relevance as to who is, or is not, thriving. Good or bad. Just people pretending statistics have a wider import (pun intended) than they really do.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:
    That rather depends on how you define "trade". That article uses a rather different definition on "trade" than any normal person.

    The article calls it "trade"-but what it really is is "international trade". 2 entirely separate things.

    We have left an international trading bloc, to become our own, (more) independent, sovereign nation. As a result, in news that should surprise precisely nobody, we export less, and import less, particularly to the EU. But, of itself, this is largely meaningless.

    France swaps lots of its products with Germany, "creating" international trade. Most of the EU are not islands-this happens. The UK is consuming more of its own product than before, thus importing and exporting less.

    None of this "data" is of any relevance as to who is, or is not, thriving. Good or bad. Just people pretending statistics have a wider import (pun intended) than they really do.

    The UK has not seen its trade bounce back since the official exit date of January 2021.

    According to the Bank of England data, trade as a percentage of GDP was around 54 percent, down from near 56 percent in 2020.

    At the same time, the EU has increased its trade close to 2018 levels.

    The bloc's trade made up roughly 73 percent of its GDP in 2021.




    It seems that the stats have been used to illustrate a comparison.
    I wonder why The Bank of England would compile and publish them if they dont mean anything?
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,783
    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:
    That rather depends on how you define "trade". That article uses a rather different definition on "trade" than any normal person.

    The article calls it "trade"-but what it really is is "international trade". 2 entirely separate things.

    We have left an international trading bloc, to become our own, (more) independent, sovereign nation. As a result, in news that should surprise precisely nobody, we export less, and import less, particularly to the EU. But, of itself, this is largely meaningless.

    France swaps lots of its products with Germany, "creating" international trade. Most of the EU are not islands-this happens. The UK is consuming more of its own product than before, thus importing and exporting less.

    None of this "data" is of any relevance as to who is, or is not, thriving. Good or bad. Just people pretending statistics have a wider import (pun intended) than they really do.

    The UK has not seen its trade bounce back since the official exit date of January 2021.

    According to the Bank of England data, trade as a percentage of GDP was around 54 percent, down from near 56 percent in 2020.

    At the same time, the EU has increased its trade close to 2018 levels.

    The bloc's trade made up roughly 73 percent of its GDP in 2021.




    It seems that the stats have been used to illustrate a comparison.
    I wonder why The Bank of England would compile and publish them if they dont mean anything?
    What "matters" is GDP. That is the true definition of "trade".

    All this set of statistics is showing is that a Continental land mass consumes less of its own product, and more of other people's than an island that does not have the same free trade rules.

    There might be economic advantages in different countries concentrating on products that have economic advantages/economies of scale. Likewise, there are inevitable effects relating to geography and the economic/climate costs of moving more stuff around. None of which is discussed.

    Sometimes people just produce stats for comparative purposes. Without a political agenda. Which is then commented upon by people for their own political or economic agenda.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:
    That rather depends on how you define "trade". That article uses a rather different definition on "trade" than any normal person.

    The article calls it "trade"-but what it really is is "international trade". 2 entirely separate things.

    We have left an international trading bloc, to become our own, (more) independent, sovereign nation. As a result, in news that should surprise precisely nobody, we export less, and import less, particularly to the EU. But, of itself, this is largely meaningless.

    France swaps lots of its products with Germany, "creating" international trade. Most of the EU are not islands-this happens. The UK is consuming more of its own product than before, thus importing and exporting less.

    None of this "data" is of any relevance as to who is, or is not, thriving. Good or bad. Just people pretending statistics have a wider import (pun intended) than they really do.

    The UK has not seen its trade bounce back since the official exit date of January 2021.

    According to the Bank of England data, trade as a percentage of GDP was around 54 percent, down from near 56 percent in 2020.

    At the same time, the EU has increased its trade close to 2018 levels.

    The bloc's trade made up roughly 73 percent of its GDP in 2021.




    It seems that the stats have been used to illustrate a comparison.
    I wonder why The Bank of England would compile and publish them if they dont mean anything?
    What "matters" is GDP. That is the true definition of "trade".

    All this set of statistics is showing is that a Continental land mass consumes less of its own product, and more of other people's than an island that does not have the same free trade rules.

    There might be economic advantages in different countries concentrating on products that have economic advantages/economies of scale. Likewise, there are inevitable effects relating to geography and the economic/climate costs of moving more stuff around. None of which is discussed.

    Sometimes people just produce stats for comparative purposes. Without a political agenda. Which is then commented upon by people for their own political or economic agenda.
    Surely measuring trade as a percentage of GDP over a number of years is a valid comparison?
    Do you think that the EU is as dependant on us, as the Brexiteers tried to have us believe in the referendum campaign?
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,783
    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:
    That rather depends on how you define "trade". That article uses a rather different definition on "trade" than any normal person.

    The article calls it "trade"-but what it really is is "international trade". 2 entirely separate things.

    We have left an international trading bloc, to become our own, (more) independent, sovereign nation. As a result, in news that should surprise precisely nobody, we export less, and import less, particularly to the EU. But, of itself, this is largely meaningless.

    France swaps lots of its products with Germany, "creating" international trade. Most of the EU are not islands-this happens. The UK is consuming more of its own product than before, thus importing and exporting less.

    None of this "data" is of any relevance as to who is, or is not, thriving. Good or bad. Just people pretending statistics have a wider import (pun intended) than they really do.

    The UK has not seen its trade bounce back since the official exit date of January 2021.

    According to the Bank of England data, trade as a percentage of GDP was around 54 percent, down from near 56 percent in 2020.

    At the same time, the EU has increased its trade close to 2018 levels.

    The bloc's trade made up roughly 73 percent of its GDP in 2021.




    It seems that the stats have been used to illustrate a comparison.
    I wonder why The Bank of England would compile and publish them if they dont mean anything?
    What "matters" is GDP. That is the true definition of "trade".

    All this set of statistics is showing is that a Continental land mass consumes less of its own product, and more of other people's than an island that does not have the same free trade rules.

    There might be economic advantages in different countries concentrating on products that have economic advantages/economies of scale. Likewise, there are inevitable effects relating to geography and the economic/climate costs of moving more stuff around. None of which is discussed.

    Sometimes people just produce stats for comparative purposes. Without a political agenda. Which is then commented upon by people for their own political or economic agenda.
    Surely measuring trade as a percentage of GDP over a number of years is a valid comparison?
    Do you think that the EU is as dependant on us, as the Brexiteers tried to have us believe in the referendum campaign?
    Only if you believe that foreign goods are better than domestic goods. Not from a "Little Englander" perspective-the same applies to all countries' home-grown products.

    Which do you think is more important for UK businesses?

    1. Where they sell their goods? or
    2. How much they sell them for, regardless of whether home or abroad?

    The EU as a whole is not as dependant on us, simply because of it's size and 20-odd natural trade partners.

    Some countries do little trade with us. Whereas some countries see is as a vital trading partner (as we are to them). The Netherlands, Spain, Portugal. Others don't like to admit how important we are for their trade (and vice versa)-like France and Ireland.

    Whereas others seek to gain advantage over competitors within the EU via harsher treatment of the UK precisely because their trade is less inter-dependant on the UK.

    Because that is the way International Trade has always worked. The big preying on the small, and everyone pretending to look for the common good while really trying to look out just for themselves. Both inside and outside trading partnerships. Before we joined the EU, while we were in it, and after we left.

    You (and I) felt superior to people who blamed every ill on our membership of the EU. Who were blind to the very real problems that leaving the EU would not solve. And that some things would get worse, not better.

    The same is also true of people who believe everything would be perfect if we could just rejoin the EU. As though the EU, which never really trusted us before, would somehow magically love to have us back, and everything in the UK would magically improve to the halcyon days of, well, never, really.
  • tai-gartai-gar Member Posts: 2,689
    They never did like us (as shown by nearly every Eurovision contest) but in truth they always respected our abilities.

    It is a pity that we were unable to establish a more effective leadership role in the EU. The future would imo have held better prospects for our Country.

  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:
    That rather depends on how you define "trade". That article uses a rather different definition on "trade" than any normal person.

    The article calls it "trade"-but what it really is is "international trade". 2 entirely separate things.

    We have left an international trading bloc, to become our own, (more) independent, sovereign nation. As a result, in news that should surprise precisely nobody, we export less, and import less, particularly to the EU. But, of itself, this is largely meaningless.

    France swaps lots of its products with Germany, "creating" international trade. Most of the EU are not islands-this happens. The UK is consuming more of its own product than before, thus importing and exporting less.

    None of this "data" is of any relevance as to who is, or is not, thriving. Good or bad. Just people pretending statistics have a wider import (pun intended) than they really do.

    The UK has not seen its trade bounce back since the official exit date of January 2021.

    According to the Bank of England data, trade as a percentage of GDP was around 54 percent, down from near 56 percent in 2020.

    At the same time, the EU has increased its trade close to 2018 levels.

    The bloc's trade made up roughly 73 percent of its GDP in 2021.




    It seems that the stats have been used to illustrate a comparison.
    I wonder why The Bank of England would compile and publish them if they dont mean anything?
    What "matters" is GDP. That is the true definition of "trade".

    All this set of statistics is showing is that a Continental land mass consumes less of its own product, and more of other people's than an island that does not have the same free trade rules.

    There might be economic advantages in different countries concentrating on products that have economic advantages/economies of scale. Likewise, there are inevitable effects relating to geography and the economic/climate costs of moving more stuff around. None of which is discussed.

    Sometimes people just produce stats for comparative purposes. Without a political agenda. Which is then commented upon by people for their own political or economic agenda.
    Surely measuring trade as a percentage of GDP over a number of years is a valid comparison?
    Do you think that the EU is as dependant on us, as the Brexiteers tried to have us believe in the referendum campaign?
    Only if you believe that foreign goods are better than domestic goods. Not from a "Little Englander" perspective-the same applies to all countries' home-grown products.

    Which do you think is more important for UK businesses?

    1. Where they sell their goods? or
    2. How much they sell them for, regardless of whether home or abroad?

    The EU as a whole is not as dependant on us, simply because of it's size and 20-odd natural trade partners.

    Some countries do little trade with us. Whereas some countries see is as a vital trading partner (as we are to them). The Netherlands, Spain, Portugal. Others don't like to admit how important we are for their trade (and vice versa)-like France and Ireland.

    Whereas others seek to gain advantage over competitors within the EU via harsher treatment of the UK precisely because their trade is less inter-dependant on the UK.

    Because that is the way International Trade has always worked. The big preying on the small, and everyone pretending to look for the common good while really trying to look out just for themselves. Both inside and outside trading partnerships. Before we joined the EU, while we were in it, and after we left.

    You (and I) felt superior to people who blamed every ill on our membership of the EU. Who were blind to the very real problems that leaving the EU would not solve. And that some things would get worse, not better.

    The same is also true of people who believe everything would be perfect if we could just rejoin the EU. As though the EU, which never really trusted us before, would somehow magically love to have us back, and everything in the UK would magically improve to the halcyon days of, well, never, really.
    'Worst of both worlds!' Dire warning over long-term impact of EU restrictions on UK



    Reacting to a report by the University of Strathclyde he told Express.co.uk the nation is now "clearly in the worst of both worlds".

    Strathclyde University's Fraser of Allander report estimates that as a result of the EU's Protocol, Northern Ireland's GDP will fall by 2.6 percent, NI exports to GB will fall by 6.1 percent, and its exports to the Rest of the World will drop by 8.6 percent.

    The report goes on to say NI employment will be 1.25 percent lower, real wages will fall by 3.9 percent, and overall consumption will fall by 2.5 percent - all against expectations before the Protocol was introduced.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/worst-of-both-worlds-dire-warning-over-long-term-impact-of-eu-restrictions-on-uk/ar-AARIWx4?ocid=msedgntp
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,783
    HAYSIE said:

    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html

    Stop reading Daily Mail headlines. They very often state precisely the opposite of the actual article.

    Poll said 54-46 in favour of remaining in the Union. Previous poll by same Company had found a small majority in favour of leaving.

    There is a reason why people think Northern Ireland may leave in the future. And it has nothing to do with Brexit.

    The percentage of Catholics in Northern Ireland is steadily increasing.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html

    Stop reading Daily Mail headlines. They very often state precisely the opposite of the actual article.

    Poll said 54-46 in favour of remaining in the Union. Previous poll by same Company had found a small majority in favour of leaving.

    There is a reason why people think Northern Ireland may leave in the future. And it has nothing to do with Brexit.

    The percentage of Catholics in Northern Ireland is steadily increasing.
    I think that the imposition of a border between NI/GB, and no border between NI/EU, has helped in any way.
    The NI/GB border is a direct result of Brexit.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html

    Stop reading Daily Mail headlines. They very often state precisely the opposite of the actual article.

    Poll said 54-46 in favour of remaining in the Union. Previous poll by same Company had found a small majority in favour of leaving.

    There is a reason why people think Northern Ireland may leave in the future. And it has nothing to do with Brexit.

    The percentage of Catholics in Northern Ireland is steadily increasing.
    Senior Tory MP warns Brexit ‘destroying’ British agriculture and condemns government failure to act




    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/senior-tory-mp-warns-brexit-destroying-british-agriculture-and-condemns-government-failure-to-act/ar-AARNwhK?ocid=msedgntp
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,783
    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html

    Stop reading Daily Mail headlines. They very often state precisely the opposite of the actual article.

    Poll said 54-46 in favour of remaining in the Union. Previous poll by same Company had found a small majority in favour of leaving.

    There is a reason why people think Northern Ireland may leave in the future. And it has nothing to do with Brexit.

    The percentage of Catholics in Northern Ireland is steadily increasing.
    Senior Tory MP warns Brexit ‘destroying’ British agriculture and condemns government failure to act




    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/senior-tory-mp-warns-brexit-destroying-british-agriculture-and-condemns-government-failure-to-act/ar-AARNwhK?ocid=msedgntp
    With the greatest of respect, this has nothing to do with Brexit.

    And everything to do with the UK Government's failure adequately to plan the way forward post-Brexit.

    This Government believes that Brexit has been "done". Whereas the reality is the UK has to stand on its own 2 feet and actually plan the best way forward. Brexit is not the end-it is merely a new beginning. Will in all probability be a mixture of good & bad-but the less we plan, the more bad there will be.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html

    Stop reading Daily Mail headlines. They very often state precisely the opposite of the actual article.

    Poll said 54-46 in favour of remaining in the Union. Previous poll by same Company had found a small majority in favour of leaving.

    There is a reason why people think Northern Ireland may leave in the future. And it has nothing to do with Brexit.

    The percentage of Catholics in Northern Ireland is steadily increasing.
    Senior Tory MP warns Brexit ‘destroying’ British agriculture and condemns government failure to act




    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/senior-tory-mp-warns-brexit-destroying-british-agriculture-and-condemns-government-failure-to-act/ar-AARNwhK?ocid=msedgntp
    With the greatest of respect, this has nothing to do with Brexit.

    And everything to do with the UK Government's failure adequately to plan the way forward post-Brexit.

    This Government believes that Brexit has been "done". Whereas the reality is the UK has to stand on its own 2 feet and actually plan the best way forward. Brexit is not the end-it is merely a new beginning. Will in all probability be a mixture of good & bad-but the less we plan, the more bad there will be.
    Patel slammed over Brexit change that could see EU citizens DEPORTED



    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/patel-slammed-over-brexit-change-that-could-see-eu-citizens-deported/ar-AARPPg1?ocid=msedgntp
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,897
    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Essexphil said:

    HAYSIE said:

    Ireland could be united within a decade, say voters in survey that reveals the majority think the North will quit the Union in a future poll



    Fears Northern Ireland will vote to quit the United Kingdom are laid bare in a poll published today. If a vote were held in Northern Ireland tomorrow, most people would vote not to join the Republic.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10300475/Ireland-unite-decade-say-voters-Survey-reveals-majority-think-North-quit-Union.html

    Stop reading Daily Mail headlines. They very often state precisely the opposite of the actual article.

    Poll said 54-46 in favour of remaining in the Union. Previous poll by same Company had found a small majority in favour of leaving.

    There is a reason why people think Northern Ireland may leave in the future. And it has nothing to do with Brexit.

    The percentage of Catholics in Northern Ireland is steadily increasing.
    Senior Tory MP warns Brexit ‘destroying’ British agriculture and condemns government failure to act




    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/senior-tory-mp-warns-brexit-destroying-british-agriculture-and-condemns-government-failure-to-act/ar-AARNwhK?ocid=msedgntp
    With the greatest of respect, this has nothing to do with Brexit.

    And everything to do with the UK Government's failure adequately to plan the way forward post-Brexit.

    This Government believes that Brexit has been "done". Whereas the reality is the UK has to stand on its own 2 feet and actually plan the best way forward. Brexit is not the end-it is merely a new beginning. Will in all probability be a mixture of good & bad-but the less we plan, the more bad there will be.
    Brexit: Minister ‘begging’ for trade deal in speech urging US to wake up and ‘make choice’



    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/brexit-minister-begging-for-trade-deal-in-speech-urging-us-to-wake-up-and-make-choice/ar-AARQw48?ocid=msedgntp
Sign In or Register to comment.