Wowser!! This is NOT the start I needed to a big grind month! Last night was not good. Obv there's bits of bad play in the mix too but I have also ran unbelievably bad the last 2 days. Literally lost every single flip aipf which is probably like 10-12, constant set over set and when I'm not getting coolered, I'm getting it in good and just getting outdrawn instead. It's been such a brutal 2 days. Not gonna post 'em up here, but was gonna post some in a thread on BBV just to vent. Either way, should be going thru some HHs with some other regs today and they can tell me how much of my play was aw ful and how much was just cruel Lost a total of £278.56 so added to Day 1, that's almost exactly £500 in 2 days. I got one more shot at 30NL with my roll, as I'll be stepping down to 20NL if I get to around the £750 mark, plz let the tables turn next sesh!! Bankroll: £878.24 (+£24.22 of C4P) Poker Points: 637 (£6.37) Posted by Lambert180
i feel your pain, im in the same boat at the minute. but forms temporary class is permenant. :-)
You'll know I don't usually read diaries but IDCU made a comment that brought me here. I've had a look at your post in BBV and treated it like a clinic post. Hope that's alright. I'm sure you've had loads of opinions from other sources on those hands anyway.
Bad couple of days for you but I'm sure you'll pull it all back soon enough.
I lost £582, £405 and £134 playing 20nl last month in three consecutive days before having 9 winning days on the trot. Don't sweat the money just grind and grind well! Take a few days if you think your other halfs life may be in danger.
Thanks everyone for the encouragement. Yeah at the time, like straight after each session, I felt pretty rubbish but that's probably fairly normal. After the event I'm much more calm and collected about it and know there's not much I can do other than play well and stick to my BRM. Admittedly I haven't fully been doing the playing well bit, there's been alot of B/C-game play involved and too many spots where I've been a bit auto-pilot and am not thinking enough about a villian's range and just went back to 'I have a good hand, I'm gonna bet'.
Don't worry guys, I'm not too down about it, and am more than willing to drop to 20NL if I need to shuold things not go to plan in the next session.
Funny that I should set a target to re-read The Mental Game of Poker the day before I go on a £500 downswing lol.
And thanks for the input on the BBV thread Borin, about to reply on there too. Intrigued to know what insult of IDCU's lead you to my diary lol.
Iv had ( i think ) 4 sessions in the last 8 months where iv lost 650+. Iv gone through the hand history of those sessions to see what went wrong.
i had coolers/suck outs that tilted me and than i started looking for flips/doing min EV plays subsequently. Im not saying you were playing awful but towards the end of your last session, you probably should of just sat and called it quits for the day
Was gonna play cash last night but when I logged in every single table had Rancid, KKrippler, EvilPingu, RemyMartin (and DTM now the cash promo has started) so just thought meh no thanks. I don't mind reg on reg action but this is probably the worst time I could get too into that, I need some easy wins to get some confidence.
So I just played a few HU SnGs while I was chatting to a few poker mates on Skype. Played 4 and won 3 (£5.25s) so £9 profit, first profitable day in a while
Bankroll: £887.24 (+£24.22 of C4P) Poker Points: 649 (£6.49)
Iv had ( i think ) 4 sessions in the last 8 months where iv lost 650+. Iv gone through the hand history of those sessions to see what went wrong. i had coolers/suck outs that tilted me and than i started looking for flips/doing min EV plays subsequently. Im not saying you were playing awful but towards the end of your last session, you probably should of just sat and called it quits for the day Posted by KKrippler
+1!!
The last night I played I did 2 sessions, lost about £150 and stood from the tables at 11pm ish I think and that still left me with 4 figures in my account JUST... then sat back down at about midnight and lost another £120 ish
I know it's not much use now Paul,but isn't it worth having say a 3-4,etc, buy-in stop loss in place for the future? or is that just not possible at the higher levels,i don't know but I don't see why it shouldn't be. I've been told that I should/could use a 2 buy-in stop loss,which I thought was a good idea... don't know if I can/will stick to it though,as I did have a 2.8 loss last sat night,after playing 9 tables though,which I have not been doing of late.
I guess having rules in place is generally a good idea... but sticking to them is maybe another thing. but if like having good BRM is a must and something we never deviate from, and is something we have learnt to do in most cases,then maybe the above or something similar would/could become the norm in time too.
I think that this is an interesting topic and maybe one that many players,myself included obviously, could improve upon within their own game,and maybe even one that many players,again myself included,have previously not given much thought to.... until now. i'm not saying that you haven't,in fact i'm sure you must have.
any thoughts? not sure if this is covered properly in 'the mental game of poker ' book,but just had a quick glance through and didn't see it,if it is i'll find it,and read up on it.
gl mate rebuilding, dev
ps; hope you don't take this post the wrong way mate.. and that it doesn't come across that way.
I thought this might get mentioned and tbh I'm a firm believer in not having stop losses. As Rancid said,
If I'm 6 tabling and on tables full of value but happen to get coolered 3 times 30 mins into the session, as long as I'm still playing well there is no reason imo to leave good games. It's the same as when people say 'take a week off', taking a week off or having stop losses is gonna have zero impact on the variance/luck you experience.
Pretty much as Rancid said really... a stop loss is fine for shot taking but I'm not doing that. So the only reason to ever leave a table is if...
1) You're playing bad 2) You need to go somewhere/you planned to finish your session at X time.
Must say I'm shocked to hear you say point 4 though Ranny. You know that things can change at any point regardless of stakes so if we're a player with an edge and a big enough BR, then why would we step down, cos obv we don't know when we're going to stop running bad?
I didn't take your post offensively at all btw Dev, thanks for the input and advice, I just don't think stop losses are for me. My discipline has just been a bit lacking in them 2 sessions, like there have been sessions before where I've sat down and stood up from all tables within 10 mins cos I just know I'm not playing great even if I haven't lost any big pots.
Definitely should have stood earlier in both sessions and there was 100% tilt involved. Cheers btw Rancid for your comments in the BBV thread, the main thing to take from that is to stop being such a mental game fish. If someone posted them hands my response would prob be exactly the same as yours and it's what I'd do in game... when I'm playing well!
Anyways, no pressure. It's alright anyway cos I'm gonna bink SPT Brum then I'll be alright
no worries Paul, just thought that if you did have a stop loss then the BIG losses wouldn't happen. but as long as you are rolled properly I guess it doesn't matter if we lose them in 1 session or the next 5,etc. I just thought it was worth a mention and as i'm still trying to progress at playing cash,even though it's early days, I am finding this area of the game most interesting at the moment.
gl as I said in building your roll back up again, dev
Must say I'm shocked to hear you say point 4 though Ranny. You know that things can change at any point regardless of stakes so if we're a player with an edge and a big enough BR, then why would we step down, cos obv we don't know when we're going to stop running bad? Posted by Lambert180
This is something that is just personal to me I think, like when your just constantly running KK into AA and set over set and just varaince kicking you in the teeth. Kinda just except that I am running horrible and maybe step down for a session or two just to minimise loses. But your right it can turn around, but I do the opposite when running good - I go up a level. Like play less when running bad and play more when running good. Just how I feel when I am playing
I don't know if it's bad or good tbh but it works for me.
I thought this might get mentioned and tbh I'm a firm believer in not having stop losses. As Rancid said, If I'm 6 tabling and on tables full of value but happen to get coolered 3 times 30 mins into the session, as long as I'm still playing well there is no reason imo to leave good games. It's the same as when people say 'take a week off', taking a week off or having stop losses is gonna have zero impact on the variance/luck you experience. Pretty much as Rancid said really... a stop loss is fine for shot taking but I'm not doing that. So the only reason to ever leave a table is if... 1) You're playing bad 2) You need to go somewhere/you planned to finish your session at X time. Must say I'm shocked to hear you say point 4 though Ranny. You know that things can change at any point regardless of stakes so if we're a player with an edge and a big enough BR, then why would we step down, cos obv we don't know when we're going to stop running bad? I didn't take your post offensively at all btw Dev, thanks for the input and advice, I just don't think stop losses are for me. My discipline has just been a bit lacking in them 2 sessions, like there have been sessions before where I've sat down and stood up from all tables within 10 mins cos I just know I'm not playing great even if I haven't lost any big pots. Definitely should have stood earlier in both sessions and there was 100% tilt involved. Cheers btw Rancid for your comments in the BBV thread, the main thing to take from that is to stop being such a mental game fish. If someone posted them hands my response would prob be exactly the same as yours and it's what I'd do in game... when I'm playing well! Anyways, no pressure. It's alright anyway cos I'm gonna bink SPT Brum then I'll be alright
Posted by Lambert180
you have to settle for 2nd i`m afraid i`m binking spt brum he he
I thought this might get mentioned and tbh I'm a firm believer in not having stop losses. As Rancid said, If I'm 6 tabling and on tables full of value but happen to get coolered 3 times 30 mins into the session, as long as I'm still playing well there is no reason imo to leave good games. It's the same as when people say 'take a week off', taking a week off or having stop losses is gonna have zero impact on the variance/luck you experience. Pretty much as Rancid said really... a stop loss is fine for shot taking but I'm not doing that. So the only reason to ever leave a table is if... 1) You're playing bad 2) You need to go somewhere/you planned to finish your session at X time. Must say I'm shocked to hear you say point 4 though Ranny. You know that things can change at any point regardless of stakes so if we're a player with an edge and a big enough BR, then why would we step down, cos obv we don't know when we're going to stop running bad? I didn't take your post offensively at all btw Dev, thanks for the input and advice, I just don't think stop losses are for me. My discipline has just been a bit lacking in them 2 sessions, like there have been sessions before where I've sat down and stood up from all tables within 10 mins cos I just know I'm not playing great even if I haven't lost any big pots. Definitely should have stood earlier in both sessions and there was 100% tilt involved. Cheers btw Rancid for your comments in the BBV thread, the main thing to take from that is to stop being such a mental game fish. If someone posted them hands my response would prob be exactly the same as yours and it's what I'd do in game... when I'm playing well! Anyways, no pressure. It's alright anyway cos I'm gonna bink SPT Brum then I'll be alright Posted by Lambert180
that I think says a lot Paul, had you done that,which is my point in asking about buy-in stop losses,would that have possibly saved you money here? dev
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 20NL to 50NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 50NL by the end of 2013 ----- June's Grind to Priority : that I think says a lot Paul, had you done that,which is my point in asking about buy-in stop losses,would that have possibly saved you money here? dev Posted by devonfish5
Yeah but that's the flaw in the process.
The other 2 nights I should have stood not because I was losing, but because I was playing bad.
Other times I'll be playing absolute A-game, playing really well and still losing, in this scenario, there's no reason for me to stand.
So it's not a stop loss ya need, it's an ability to identify your own tilt or just bad play and have the discipline to just say 'ok I was gonna do a 3 huor session and I'm only 30 mins, but I'm leaving now'. As I said, I've done this myself in other sessions, but just didn't do it the other 2 nights. Probably some residual tilt from bricking about 16541351 MTTs last month.
In Response to Re: Lambert180 ----- 20NL to 50NL ----- Target = 50BIs for 50NL by the end of 2013 ----- June's Grind to Priority : Yeah but that's the flaw in the process. The other 2 nights I should have stood not because I was losing, but because I was playing bad. Other times I'll be playing absolute A-game, playing really well and still losing, in this scenario, there's no reason for me to stand. So it's not a stop loss ya need, it's an ability to identify your own tilt or just bad play and have the discipline to just say 'ok I was gonna do a 3 huor session and I'm only 30 mins, but I'm leaving now'. As I said, I've done this myself in other sessions, but just didn't do it the other 2 nights. Probably some residual tilt from bricking about 16541351 MTTs last month. Posted by Lambert180
ok got you.
I find though that when i'm running well I tend to play well too, (or so it feels) and when i'm running bad my play tends to drop down with it, as a general rule. and I also think in my case anyway,that the 2 go hand in hand...
ie; run well/play well = win run bad.play bad = lose.
so would I not be better off giving myself say 4-5 buy-in stop loss when I run bad and end up losing? or should I continue playing and trying to win my money back? which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't.
i just dont think your good enough to lose £500 in 2 days on 20 nl takes some doing tbh i couldnt even do that on 50 nl if i run bad i looked at ya bad beat hands the last hand is funny Posted by IDONKCALLU
Go troll somewhere else plz.
The reason you couldn't lose £500 @ 50NL is cos you're a massive nit who won't put money in the pot without quads pre-flop, you don't take any risks and play a low variance style.
I'm playing 30NL btw, not 20NL. If you're saying it's impossible you'd ever lose 15 BIs in a row when 6/7tabling, then you're doing something wrong. Also if you look up, you'll see DTM said he lost £1121 in 3 consecutive days and that was at 20NL, is he not good enough either cos that's more than double me at smaller stakes? But then you seem to think Rancid is bad as well dont ya lol....
Btw, the last hand is probably one of the least bad ones you could have picked, given their stack I think it's pretty standard
rancid has never beat me on any cash table you have had ya time running good think u should find another hobbie this is getting abit expensive people have sussed u out Posted by IDONKCALLU
Yeah, it's one **** of an expensive hobby... I deposited £20, now have nearly £900 and have made withdrawals... definitely need to find a cheaper way of having fun!
its took ya 2 years to get to where u are now its took me 5 months and ive won double what u have like i said u talk a good game on the foums and poker clinic but u have no game ya biting i see now u know what its like for some 1 to have a go at ya not nice is it im just 1 person i had 30 people on the forum have a go at me not nice is it u lot have won u wanted me to leave the site and i have i wnt play on here again jealous haters win im a threat to any 1 on a mtt and cash tables thats why ya all wind me up jealous haters i still be on the forums tho Posted by IDONKCALLU
I'm not gonna continue with this childish arguement but try to remember that you always say how you've been playing like like 10+ years, you don't get to just start the clock from whenever it was your heater starts lol.
Donk, neither me or anyone else wanted you to leave the site. There were about 6 people on the thread not 30 lol, and I'm not even one of the ones that was having a go at you! I said it was out of order (and I stand by that). FWIW, I know what it's like actually, until alot of them got kicked out I had a ton of haters in that FB group that just jumped on every word I said and I still get loads of haters on here too, but meh just leave them to it. You gotta just take it on the chin and realise there will always be people eager to have a go.
I'm happy to delete my comments if you do the same.
Comments
You'll know I don't usually read diaries but IDCU made a comment that brought me here. I've had a look at your post in BBV and treated it like a clinic post. Hope that's alright. I'm sure you've had loads of opinions from other sources on those hands anyway.
Bad couple of days for you but I'm sure you'll pull it all back soon enough.
if the answer is no, then there's nothing else you can do.
upswings and downswings happen for sometimes no reason - varaince !
Why do we play with BRM, to avoid ruin.
I recently had a £600 upswing followed by a £400 downswing, it happens.
Just gotta be honest with yourself and identify any bad play and eradicate it.
chin up
Don't worry guys, I'm not too down about it, and am more than willing to drop to 20NL if I need to shuold things not go to plan in the next session.
Funny that I should set a target to re-read The Mental Game of Poker the day before I go on a £500 downswing lol.
And thanks for the input on the BBV thread Borin, about to reply on there too. Intrigued to know what insult of IDCU's lead you to my diary lol.
Was gonna play cash last night but when I logged in every single table had Rancid, KKrippler, EvilPingu, RemyMartin (and DTM now the cash promo has started) so just thought meh no thanks. I don't mind reg on reg action but this is probably the worst time I could get too into that, I need some easy wins to get some confidence.
So I just played a few HU SnGs while I was chatting to a few poker mates on Skype. Played 4 and won 3 (£5.25s) so £9 profit, first profitable day in a while
Bankroll: £887.24 (+£24.22 of C4P)
Poker Points: 649 (£6.49)
The last night I played I did 2 sessions, lost about £150 and stood from the tables at 11pm ish I think and that still left me with 4 figures in my account JUST... then sat back down at about midnight and lost another £120 ish
or is that just not possible at the higher levels,i don't know but I don't see why it shouldn't be.
I've been told that I should/could use a 2 buy-in stop loss,which I thought was a good idea...
don't know if I can/will stick to it though,as I did have a 2.8 loss last sat night,after playing 9 tables though,which I have not been doing of late.
I guess having rules in place is generally a good idea...
but sticking to them is maybe another thing.
but if like having good BRM is a must and something we never deviate from, and is something we have learnt to do in most cases,then maybe the above or something similar would/could become the norm in time too.
I think that this is an interesting topic and maybe one that many players,myself included obviously, could improve upon within their own game,and maybe even one that many players,again myself included,have previously not given much thought to....
until now.
i'm not saying that you haven't,in fact i'm sure you must have.
any thoughts?
not sure if this is covered properly in 'the mental game of poker ' book,but just had a quick glance through and didn't see it,if it is i'll find it,and read up on it.
gl mate rebuilding,
dev
ps; hope you don't take this post the wrong way mate..
and that it doesn't come across that way.
1. if your playing bad, then take a break and re focus - if you can't then quit
2. if your playing good and losing, carry on unless tilt makes you start playing bad - refer to point 1
3. if your tilt affects your play, then quit
4. If you feel your just running abso bad, step down a level and ride it out - minimises loses
ps. don't put too much pressure on yourself to win
good luck
If I'm 6 tabling and on tables full of value but happen to get coolered 3 times 30 mins into the session, as long as I'm still playing well there is no reason imo to leave good games. It's the same as when people say 'take a week off', taking a week off or having stop losses is gonna have zero impact on the variance/luck you experience.
Pretty much as Rancid said really... a stop loss is fine for shot taking but I'm not doing that. So the only reason to ever leave a table is if...
1) You're playing bad
2) You need to go somewhere/you planned to finish your session at X time.
Must say I'm shocked to hear you say point 4 though Ranny. You know that things can change at any point regardless of stakes so if we're a player with an edge and a big enough BR, then why would we step down, cos obv we don't know when we're going to stop running bad?
I didn't take your post offensively at all btw Dev, thanks for the input and advice, I just don't think stop losses are for me. My discipline has just been a bit lacking in them 2 sessions, like there have been sessions before where I've sat down and stood up from all tables within 10 mins cos I just know I'm not playing great even if I haven't lost any big pots.
Definitely should have stood earlier in both sessions and there was 100% tilt involved. Cheers btw Rancid for your comments in the BBV thread, the main thing to take from that is to stop being such a mental game fish. If someone posted them hands my response would prob be exactly the same as yours and it's what I'd do in game... when I'm playing well!
Anyways, no pressure. It's alright anyway cos I'm gonna bink SPT Brum then I'll be alright
no worries Paul,
just thought that if you did have a stop loss then the BIG losses wouldn't happen.
but as long as you are rolled properly I guess it doesn't matter if we lose them in 1 session or the next 5,etc.
I just thought it was worth a mention and as i'm still trying to progress at playing cash,even though it's early days, I am finding this area of the game most interesting at the moment.
gl as I said in building your roll back up again,
dev
This is something that is just personal to me I think, like when your just constantly running KK into AA and set over set and just varaince kicking you in the teeth. Kinda just except that I am running horrible and maybe step down for a session or two just to minimise loses. But your right it can turn around, but I do the opposite when running good - I go up a level.
Like play less when running bad and play more when running good.
Just how I feel when I am playing
I don't know if it's bad or good tbh but it works for me.
had you done that,which is my point in asking about buy-in stop losses,would that have possibly saved you money here?
dev
The other 2 nights I should have stood not because I was losing, but because I was playing bad.
Other times I'll be playing absolute A-game, playing really well and still losing, in this scenario, there's no reason for me to stand.
So it's not a stop loss ya need, it's an ability to identify your own tilt or just bad play and have the discipline to just say 'ok I was gonna do a 3 huor session and I'm only 30 mins, but I'm leaving now'. As I said, I've done this myself in other sessions, but just didn't do it the other 2 nights. Probably some residual tilt from bricking about 16541351 MTTs last month.
I find though that when i'm running well I tend to play well too, (or so it feels)
and when i'm running bad my play tends to drop down with it, as a general rule.
and I also think in my case anyway,that the 2 go hand in hand...
ie; run well/play well = win
run bad.play bad = lose.
so would I not be better off giving myself say 4-5 buy-in stop loss when I run bad and end up losing?
or should I continue playing and trying to win my money back?
which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't.
The reason you couldn't lose £500 @ 50NL is cos you're a massive nit who won't put money in the pot without quads pre-flop, you don't take any risks and play a low variance style.
I'm playing 30NL btw, not 20NL. If you're saying it's impossible you'd ever lose 15 BIs in a row when 6/7tabling, then you're doing something wrong. Also if you look up, you'll see DTM said he lost £1121 in 3 consecutive days and that was at 20NL, is he not good enough either cos that's more than double me at smaller stakes? But then you seem to think Rancid is bad as well dont ya lol....
Btw, the last hand is probably one of the least bad ones you could have picked, given their stack I think it's pretty standard
Donk, neither me or anyone else wanted you to leave the site. There were about 6 people on the thread not 30 lol, and I'm not even one of the ones that was having a go at you! I said it was out of order (and I stand by that). FWIW, I know what it's like actually, until alot of them got kicked out I had a ton of haters in that FB group that just jumped on every word I said and I still get loads of haters on here too, but meh just leave them to it. You gotta just take it on the chin and realise there will always be people eager to have a go.
I'm happy to delete my comments if you do the same.