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When ? Does playing the best Poker, ever 'pay off' ?

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  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    My last and final contribution, (realise ‘very boring’)
    Maybe not so boring, when ‘one’ is on the wrong end off;

    Monday evening, the late rebuy 13578446016

    Pocket 10 10 not laying it down, at any price, against a flopped set, and a turned full house, and naturally ‘gets there’ as a maximum 3% chance on the river, raise and reraise called twice on the flop, and ‘all in’ in front called on the turn.7000 chip pot and exit hand.
    (Maybe, after all) I do need ‘some help’ on how to play Poker!

    Monday evening early, Deep stack 1357720441

    Aces rivered 11000 chip pot by the 4% chance getting there on the river

    Monday afternoon Rebuy 1355486965

    Something like two and a half hours play, I look down at AA ,naturally the big stack is calling a 1600 raise pre,with pocket 6 10 ,flop brings a 9 high board, and three spades to go with my As Ad,(nut flush draw) and naturally the 18% chance pre, gets there.

    £500 bounty hunter 1341915765

    For near 7000 chips, nothing like a bit of turn river runner runner to take it down as an 18% chance

    And finally, calling a huge shove by pocket J4 with AQ, 65% fav through the turn!
    Just wish, for a ‘bit’ of the probable, as opposed to………… just being ‘unlucky’.
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    PokerkingdSmall blind30.0030.004880.00
    Rynoo2016Big blind60.0090.006780.00
    Your hole cards
    • 6
    • 7
    misterpjCall60.00150.003297.50
    MollyjackCall60.00210.001910.00
    ChilliguruFold
    PokerkingdCall30.00240.004850.00
    Rynoo2016Raise60.00300.006720.00
    misterpjCall60.00360.003237.50
    MollyjackCall60.00420.001850.00
    PokerkingdFold
    Flop
    • 6
    • 2
    • 6
    Rynoo2016Bet210.00630.006510.00
    misterpjRaise420.001050.002817.50
    MollyjackFold
    Rynoo2016Raise420.001470.006090.00
    misterpjRaise1620.003090.001197.50
    Rynoo2016Call1410.004500.004680.00
    Turn
    • 2
    Rynoo2016Bet2250.006750.002430.00
    misterpjAll-in1197.507947.500.00
    Rynoo2016Unmatched bet1052.506895.003482.50
    Rynoo2016Show
    • 10
    • 10
    misterpjShow
    • 6
    • 7
    River
    • 10
    Rynoo2016WinFull House, 10s and 6s6895.0010377.50
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    Chrisss21Small blind200.00200.0017340.00
    tam1956Big blind400.00600.0039175.00
    Your hole cards
    • 10
    • A
    misterpjRaise800.001400.0017221.87
    eddie43Fold
    Ledgy16Call800.002200.0035409.38
    Chrisss21Fold
    tam1956Fold
    Flop
    • 6
    • 2
    • A
    misterpjBet1650.003850.0015571.87
    Ledgy16Call1650.005500.0033759.38
    Turn
    • Q
    misterpjCheck
    Ledgy16Check
    River
    • 9
    misterpjCheck
    Ledgy16Bet2750.008250.0031009.38
    misterpjCall2750.0011000.0012821.87
    Ledgy16Show
    • 9
    • 9
    misterpjShow
    • 10
    • A
    Ledgy16WinThree 9s11000.0042009.38
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    BURTPUSSYSmall blind400.00400.0033590.00
    LENNYCBig blind800.001200.0018970.00
    Your hole cards
    • A
    • A
    Bait1987Fold
    misterpjRaise1600.002800.005806.25
    bazbFold
    BURTPUSSYFold
    LENNYCCall800.003600.0018170.00
    Flop
    • 7
    • 8
    • 9
    LENNYCBet800.004400.0017370.00
    misterpjAll-in5806.2510206.250.00
    LENNYCCall5006.2515212.5012363.75
    LENNYCShow
    • 10
    • 6
    misterpjShow
    • A
    • A
    Turn
    • 6
    River
    • 4
    LENNYCWinStraight to the 1015212.5027576.25
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    DADY613Small blind150.00150.0011535.00
    misterpjBig blind300.00450.002722.50
    Your hole cards
    • J
    • K
    2BLuckyFold
    N1VEKFold
    louie54Call300.00750.007617.50
    DADY613Call150.00900.0011385.00
    misterpjCheck
    Flop
    • K
    • 8
    • Q
    DADY613Bet300.001200.0011085.00
    misterpjAll-in2722.503922.500.00
    louie54Call2722.506645.004895.00
    DADY613Fold
    misterpjShow
    • J
    • K
    louie54Show
    • 10
    • 9
    Turn
    • 6
    River
    • 7
    louie54WinStraight to the 106645.0011540.00
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    BenWS147Small blind15000.0015000.00266100.00
    misterpjBig blind30000.0045000.00359900.00
    Your hole cards
    • A
    • Q
    BenWS147All-in266100.00311100.000.00
    misterpjCall251100.00562200.00108800.00
    BenWS147Show
    • J
    • 4
    misterpjShow
    • A
    • Q
    Flop
    • 9
    • 3
    • K
    Turn
    • 3
    River
    • A
    BenWS147WinFlush to the Ace562200.00562200.00
  • Options
    Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 161,274

    "Pocket 10 10 not laying it down, at any price, against a flopped set"

    You never had a flopped set - you flopped trips, not a set. Big difference.
  • Options
    MattBatesMattBates Member Posts: 4,118
    edited February 2019
    The big problem here is you say you are playing "the best poker" but as Feelgroggy said there are a lot of hands that you butchered. There are mistakes that your opponents have made in some of the hands and this is great for us but don't focus on that. Our opponents making mistakes will make us money long term but you need to focus on your own plays and the losing plays that you are making. I wont go through every hand but for example, limping 67o isn't a winning play so I would be looking at eradicating errors like this. (Also, not that it matters a great deal but your opponent is 4.55% to win.) The A10 seems fairly standard that our opponent calls the flop bet, they get lucky on the river but effectively all that happened is you lost a flip. In an earlier hand you cold call a 3b from the bb with k8 suited so you can analyse the later streets but plays like this are losing plays. The QQ v AKss hand you posted you are only 51% to win, there will be a lot of flips you win or lose when you play.
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    Mr K, I concur, actually Love Poker, and, believe it or not Skypoker,but, be fair,look at All the betting action on that exact hand? Not entitled to smash my head, kick the door? Again? X
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    If I have lost the plot, I aplogise, flopped trips,turned set,chased down by a solitary pocket pair, less than a 5 % chance to get there? ,and just got done,less than 5% again, ! Turn river runner runner flushed! I know, just poker, but.... all the best
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    Lost the plot! It's late! Flopped trips, turned FH, chased by a pair x
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    Will certainly not, be, posting any more, of my ‘boring’ personal Poker experience(s)
    Had, I been able to wish upon myself, only a few hours after writing the above, a hand of poker, in an mtt, that succinctly summed up, months, of my personal poker sure enough, it had to come along!
    18.39 last night, Thursday evening, and when, you are on the wrong end of these, daily, (not multitabling) not multiplying it up, to ‘huge volumes’ of 330 buy ins a day, it is beyond soul destroying, in the poker sense, and more than an irretent,of ‘perceived poker ability’
    I will briefly, describe, the hand below, (and happy to be shot down in flames) if my analysis, is deemed incorrect, which I would describe, as set mining, in its purest Poker sense.
    A pocket pair, calling a pre flop raise, (in the appropriate situation) when the flop, ‘joy of joys’ completes the set, on the one time that Poker probability says it will, in approximately eight attempts. Happy to be corrected? Set in stone, in my mind, pocket pair, to a flopped set, is between a 13/2 to 15/2 shot? Six handed.
    That, in itself, means nothing other than, Poker player (A) has now got a spot, where the possibility exists, of removing a large chunk of chips, from player (B)
    And, a point to note, might make one or two of you smile, any poker probability, and poker maths, any poker percentages, I have ever ‘joisted with the forum over’ have always, been based on ‘live cards’ still being in the deck, if, discussing, hundreds of hands, simple logic, dictate’s, no way, all live cards remain in the deck, and in the following example, who is to say? Out of eight folded cards, there was not a K amongst them? I just hope, that example, might? Reveal me, to be not ‘exactly the Poker Philistine’ I may have portrayed myself as, and boy oh boy, do I struggle with articulation.
    The hand I referenced from early Sunday,(after a good few hours play) it may have only been a little mtt,still north of £300 in prize pool, and that was for such a huge chip lead, with only 11 runners left ? I played the best poker, did everything right, and 4.55% takes me down, on the river. (If all live cards remain!)
    The bounty hunter hand from Monday, pocket JJ, flopped SET, I played the best poker, did everything right, 96.77% favourite (if all live cards remain!) turn river runner runner.
    I could go, on and on and on, but won’t, last night’s hand, a flopped set, against a pocket pair, as you will see, all the betting action, on the flop, 89% fav v 11%,improves to 96% v 4% (if all live cards remain !) And the worst thing of all, when your Poker sixth sense, tells you, it is going to happen again, and the one? Or two outer hits?
    As, a very final attempt, at articulation, Sat 00.30 through Sun 00.30, approximately, within that period,26 separate buyins,accumalitive 14 hours play,concentrating,enjoying Poker, being absorbed in table dynamics,( if I am not in a hand, I love to observe closely),if ‘one’ does not have the cards, or the spots, no matter how brilliant a poker player anyone is, there is not much you can do,so,focus,and patience, it is not exactly the pennies and the pounds, buy ins in that period, approximately £100,loss,approximately £30,and,at the very best, a 4% chance rivers me, if I had of held up in that hand, the chip lead was huge, ’smoke a Hamlet’ and ladder to heads up ! If any of the senior readers, remember, Mr Hellmuth v Mr Ferguson heads up, final table, I think Ferguson hit a miracle 9 on the river, and Mr Hellmuth, in the full literal sense, ‘collapsed to the floor’ ..Well so did..misterpj! About a baker’s dozen times, in the last week...
    Best Wishes,hope gifted a chuckle or two in the forums direction.
    one day, maybe? bankroll,200 buy ins, average buy in £11, (£2200) non turbo DYMs, £5.50 - £22, MTTs £5.50 - £22, thanks for reading, ‘have mercy’ !

  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    davidm550Small blind100.00100.007170.00
    seahorse55Big blind200.00300.009190.00
    Your hole cards
    • 2
    • 2
    891925Raise600.00900.005800.00
    theoldfogeFold
    jimbo90776Fold
    misterpjCall600.001500.009098.75
    davidm550Fold
    seahorse55Fold
    Flop
    • Q
    • 2
    • 9
    891925Bet1125.002625.004675.00
    misterpjRaise3000.005625.006098.75
    891925All-in4675.0010300.000.00
    misterpjCall2800.0013100.003298.75
    891925Show
    • K
    • K
    misterpjShow
    • 2
    • 2
    Turn
    • 4
    River
    • K
    891925WinThree Kings13100.0013100.00
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    ELVIS66Small blind400.00400.007302.50
    LENNYCBig blind800.001200.0061300.00
    Your hole cards
    • A
    • 8
    misterpjRaise1600.002800.0036922.50
    ShiloFold
    arragonCall1600.004400.0065782.50
    ELVIS66Fold
    LENNYCCall800.005200.0060500.00
    Flop
    • 8
    • 8
    • 10
    LENNYCBet5200.0010400.0055300.00
    misterpjRaise10400.0020800.0026522.50
    arragonFold
    LENNYCAll-in55300.0076100.000.00
    misterpjAll-in26522.50102622.500.00
    LENNYCUnmatched bet23577.5079045.0023577.50
    LENNYCShow
    • 10
    • 9
    misterpjShow
    • A
    • 8
    Turn
    • 2
    River
    • 10
    LENNYCWinFull House, 10s and 8s79045.00102622.50
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    HAMMER001Small blind30.0030.002310.00
    SauvageBig blind60.0090.002045.00
    Your hole cards
    • J
    • J
    misterpjRaise120.00210.002385.00
    rossifumiFold
    Sezz99Call120.00330.002000.00
    _Prodigy_Call120.00450.001125.00
    HAMMER001All-in2310.002760.000.00
    SauvageFold
    misterpjCall2220.004980.00165.00
    Sezz99Fold
    _Prodigy_Fold
    HAMMER001Show
    • Q
    • A
    misterpjShow
    • J
    • J
    Flop
    • 7
    • Q
    • J
    Turn
    • K
    River
    • 10
    HAMMER001WinStraight to the Ace4980.004980.00
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    'missing you all' hope The Poker God's, are treating you kindly ?

    It's been a while........Now I need to remind myself,what was my question ?

    Oh yes, I remembered,something along the lines,of 'playing the best Poker'

    As,I take 'on board' the 'pest' that is Varience (hmm)

    Kind of a hard bridge to cross,that,playing the best Poker,will bring its rewards,based on evidence,so to that end my dear Poker ladies and gentleman,can I offer you, from a couple of days ago,the following.

    Something approaching three and a half hours play,tournament life,risked not once (well not once until something like,three and a half hours play,final table,six handed)

    Oh, and yes, I know ' Optimum Poker,Best Poker,( not always rewarded,)

    But once in a while, ( any chance ? all in so good ( 95% plus favourite )

    To yet again, for the umpteenth time,Lose Another Key hand, as a 95% favourite.

    turn river, runner runner again ( so used to it,I almost expect it !)

    Does Varience, work the other way ? ' tongue jammed in check'

    ' just a litte bit of varying back', something like,winning a hand like that 95 times out of a hundred,instead, in my case,losing hands like that, ( if I put the actual % no one would believe)

    think this is isolated ?, well, I will post this one for now ,and can easily post FIVE more exact same scenario's, from the last few days.

    I defy,any of the best players on here,to keep a straight face,and tell me,I played this hand; awful,chronic,non optimum, or any other adjective,maybe my bet sizing was all kaput again ? eh Phil (rofl) much love all.

    Paul (have mercy,unlucky just hard to accept)
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    raystoreySmall blind800.00800.0030267.50
    bazza999Big blind1600.002400.0020375.00
    Your hole cards
    • J
    • J
    misterpjRaise3200.005600.008693.75
    DrudkhFold
    mad14it13Fold
    Woogie8688Fold
    raystoreyCall2400.008000.0027867.50
    bazza999Fold
    Flop
    • K
    • J
    • 7
    raystoreyCheck
    misterpjBet4000.0012000.004693.75
    raystoreyCall4000.0016000.0023867.50
    Turn
    • Q
    raystoreyCheck
    misterpjAll-in4693.7520693.750.00
    raystoreyCall4693.7525387.5019173.75
    raystoreyShow
    • 10
    • 10
    misterpjShow
    • J
    • J
    River
    • 9
    raystoreyWinStraight to the King25387.5044561.25
  • Options
    madprofmadprof Member Posts: 3,306
    Hey

    I can keep a straight face coz I’m not a good player...surely the key consideration is the timescale by which you seem to be getting a bad run of cards against you.

    Just as at the same time surely you get a run of hands that go for you? And again within a timescale, eg I won a 15k freeroll seat for tomorrow where no matter what hand I played! I seem to hit,even down to rivering my opponent in similar circumstances more than once...

    I’m still new to this game-4 years or so- but as a rec player I do seem to get a lot of bad beats like this...oh and a lot of good ones as well ONLINE.. I don’t seem to get the variances as often live-either way

    @Tikay10 - still new, you corrected him earlier on when trip/set where mentioned, what’s the difference ,please?
  • Options
    Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 161,274
    edited March 2019
    Type your comment
    madprof said:

    Hey

    I can keep a straight face coz I’m not a good player...surely the key consideration is the timescale by which you seem to be getting a bad run of cards against you.

    Just as at the same time surely you get a run of hands that go for you? And again within a timescale, eg I won a 15k freeroll seat for tomorrow where no matter what hand I played! I seem to hit,even down to rivering my opponent in similar circumstances more than once...

    I’m still new to this game-4 years or so- but as a rec player I do seem to get a lot of bad beats like this...oh and a lot of good ones as well ONLINE.. I don’t seem to get the variances as often live-either way

    @Tikay10 - still new, you corrected him earlier on when trip/set where mentioned, what’s the difference ,please?

    Trips are when the board pairs & we have a card to match, as in, say, the board comes 2-6-J-J-5 & we have a J in our hand.

    A Set is when we have a pair in our hand & a third card of the same value hits the board, as in, say, we have 3-3, & the board comes 2-3-9-6-Q

    Sets are much stronger than trips.

  • Options
    madprofmadprof Member Posts: 3,306
    Tikay10 said:

    Type your comment

    madprof said:

    Hey

    I can keep a straight face coz I’m not a good player...surely the key consideration is the timescale by which you seem to be getting a bad run of cards against you.

    Just as at the same time surely you get a run of hands that go for you? And again within a timescale, eg I won a 15k freeroll seat for tomorrow where no matter what hand I played! I seem to hit,even down to rivering my opponent in similar circumstances more than once...

    I’m still new to this game-4 years or so- but as a rec player I do seem to get a lot of bad beats like this...oh and a lot of good ones as well ONLINE.. I don’t seem to get the variances as often live-either way

    @Tikay10 - still new, you corrected him earlier on when trip/set where mentioned, what’s the difference ,please?

    Trips are when the board pairs & we have a card to match, as in, say, the board comes 2-6-J-J-5 & we have a J in our hand.

    A Set is when we have a pair in our hand & a third card of the same value hits the board, as in, say, we have 3-3, & the board comes 2-3-9-6-Q

    Sets are much stronger than trips.

    Thanks for such a straight forward explanation - I get that a set is stronger....or should I say I hope I get a set more often! Cheers...no bet today?
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    only for clarity, that is Tuesday evenings,deep stack MTT, tourney running near 3 hours 40 mins, a bakers dozen (13) players left.

    My 3000 big blind,two players come along for a look at the flop.My big blind,zero to see a flop. Will leave the rest for your own eyes to see,emphasis on, a pot worth 158,000,poker maths 90% + ( 92%) favorite. as it happens, misterpj chip leader,chip count was something like, 95,000, 65,000,35,000,that was first second and third at that time.

    In case you can't stand the suspense, any longer, turn river runner runner (again !), having snap called the 10 10 all in, with a flopped straight.

    I know what you are thinking... misterpj having (for once,a brag !) take a look my Poker friends. My big blind,zero to see a flop.Poker Maths 92% favorite.So the all in shove,as an 8% chance,which I have to call,picks up a 158,000 chip pot,and a 120,000 chip lead.Nice work,if you can get it.
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    Richard923Small blind1500.001500.0029015.50
    misterpjBig blind3000.004500.0093267.50
    Your hole cards
    • 8
    • 4
    madmick078Fold
    NipperoCall3000.007500.0073931.62
    gandadFold
    Richard923Call1500.009000.0027515.50
    misterpjCheck
    Flop
    • 7
    • 6
    • 5
    Richard923Check
    misterpjBet6750.0015750.0086517.50
    NipperoAll-in73931.6289681.620.00
    Richard923Fold
    misterpjCall67181.62156863.2419335.88
    misterpjShow
    • 8
    • 4
    NipperoShow
    • 10
    • 10
    Turn
    • 5
    River
    • 10
    NipperoWinFull House, 10s and 5s156863.24156863.24
  • Options
    misterpjmisterpj Member Posts: 3,204
    I found,these wise words,scribed,right here,by someone,who does not know it,but actually has,my full,complete,and utter respect.

    those words,are; 'I do wish,I could explain to the skeptics,how Poker works,'it's just maths'

    And, I agree (whole heartedly)

    battered, 12 hours solid
    PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
    winnie29Small blind50.0050.004141.25
    dazzer66Big blind100.00150.003425.00
    Your hole cards
    • Q
    • 10
    86notoutFold
    misterpjCall100.00250.002095.00
    SirJordashFold
    DebstarmacFold
    winnie29Call50.00300.004091.25
    dazzer66Check
    Flop
    • 6
    • 9
    • Q
    winnie29Check
    dazzer66Check
    misterpjBet225.00525.001870.00
    winnie29Call225.00750.003866.25
    dazzer66Fold
    Turn
    • 8
    winnie29All-in3866.254616.250.00
    misterpjAll-in1870.006486.250.00
    winnie29Unmatched bet1996.254490.001996.25
    winnie29Show
    • 6
    • 7
    misterpjShow
    • Q
    • 10
    River
    • 6
    winnie29WinThree 6s4490.006486.25
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